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89

Microsoft goes back on its word for Windows Phone 7.8 feature requests

Microsoft Feedback

She's not wanting your features, gosh darn it.

News of Microsoft backtracking on offering consumers the opportunity to provide requests for features in Windows Phone 7.8 has been circling multiple sources today. This is due to a reply to a User Voice thread that apologises for misleading consumers through a previous reply, which turned out to be badly worded. 

A few days ago we covered a member of the Windows Phone team taking to its User Voice page to reveal that consumers can post and vote on feature requests, which would then be taken into account of inclusion in Windows Phone 7.8. This was seen as a positive move by many (including ourselves) to involve the community to shape the next update.

"As you know, Windows Phone 8 is a generational shift in technology, which means that it will not run on existing hardware.

BUT we care deeply about our existing customers and would like to know SPECIFICALLY what features you would like to see on 7.8 and vote INDIVIDUALLY for the one that you want most (vs. one large grab bag of features)."

Now as we look at the post above, there's nothing suggesting the team is actively looking for more features to include in the next upgrade for current and past Windows Phone hardware, but the post itself could have arguably been worded differently. Unless it's specifically stated they want feature ideas, we should always take what's said lightly. The way this post was published led to consumers, ourselves and other sources believing the team is seeking user input.

A follow-up reply was published to the User Voice thread after news sources picked up on the apparent ability to request features for inclusion. The official response was as follows:

"We are truly floored over the excitement about future Windows Phone releases. Unfortunately our earlier response on this post was not well worded. We really do care about your feedback. This forum is intended to seek suggestions on future product features but it is not set up to take requests for specific product versions. We apologize for the confusion.

We would like to reinforce that for this forum to work optimally we would need users to create unique suggestions each with a single idea. This particular suggestion item has many varied ideas and because of that we aren’t able to infer what is the most important to this forum. Please reallocate your votes to other suggestions that have a single idea."

This doesn't mean the company isn't listening to customers and would rather not receive feedback and feature requests, as we're pretty sure they actively read through threads on User Voice and more. What this probably means is the Windows Phone team is working flat out to get both Apollo and 7.8 ready in a timely fashion. We're looking at a combined launch for Windows 8, Windows Phone and the Surface tablets, not to mention pushing the Windows Phone 7.8 update out to existing customers with older hardware.

We're still unsure as to what's included in both Apollo abnd 7.8, and we have to imagine just how many feature requests are submitted by consumers. It's not that Microsoft doesn't care, it's more likely due to lack of time, resource and mounting pressure caused by tight release schedules.

Source: Uservoice, via: Windows Phone Daily

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Comments

There are 89 comments. Sign in to comment

pbroy says:

That feeling you get when you think you are about to get lucky. Then at the last minute, she tells you she's on her period.

Are you referring to the woman in the picture?

pbroy says:

"She's not wanting your features, gosh darn it."
As for the lady in the picture, God must have blessed her with some mighty reproductive organs, for that to be true. She is pretty hot though. ;)

Rich Edmonds says:

True story, that.

lippidp says:

Period shmeriod.  What about the "back door"?????......

jdep1 says:

+1 MS- "We care about our costumers that we want to know what features you would like to see on 7.8 Oh, ok good to know but honestly 7.8 is good enough you are lucky we are giving you something". We are currently focusing on wp8 but good to know what you WISH for keep dreaming.

schlubadub says:

Pfft that's what towels and showers were invented for

mans550 says:

Blood never hurt nobody :-]

Word mans550, I'm afraid of no blood.

shmuntz says:

Oh yeah man, I'm coming inside my wife way faster when she's bleeding there, it works like extra lube. Sex is double pleasure this way and she doesn't mind either.
So pretending sex is not possible when she's on her period is a flat out lie. For some couples like me and my wife it's actually MORE sex and MORE pleasure when she's bleeding. No condoms, no back doors, none of this nosense. Just come right inside her pussy whenever you want. Best pleasure ever, in my experience.

jkercado says:

Uh, TMI. Keep it PG, guys.

aubreyq says:

Yeah that one was WAY too graphic.

ScarletStar says:

Am I the only one who had to google twice to understand than one line? D:

schlubadub says:

Uh, which one?

pbroy says:

a little too graphic there bro.. :P

shmuntz says:

Err... ok sorry guys, I didn't actually put any illustrative pictures in my post so don't get it why you call it graphic :)
Anyway if people are offended by such a natural and good thing as sex... I'm deleting my post above.
Totally unexpected reaction, but whatever. No offence to anyone.
EDIT: ah f*ck :( I can't edit and can't do anything about it now. Too bad this site doesn't allow me to edit my posts. Well anyone who feels offended please email site admin and ask them to remove it. Tell him/her shumntz would like to censor it but he can't :( Damn :(

The reaction is more that this is a tech site not a porn site, and the whole subject is way off topic of the post. That and we actually have some younger readers too.

shmuntz says:

"we actually have some younger readers"
 
what child in his healthy mind (besides Ballmer's kids of course) would read this site? are you even serious implying that children are interested in windows phone?? woah, that was gross... I don't even know what to say... this must be some weird joke or something
 
"whole subject is way off topic"
 
I was just replying to offtopic posts about blood, period etc started by other people. blame them for starting it, not me :P
 
"this is a tech site not a porn site"
 
sex between legally married for 9 years man and woman who have two kids, still passionately love each other, and never cheated on each other (that's about me and my wife btw) probably should not be called "porn", I reserve this word for sex between people who were paid for it.
 
porn is more like a regular daily job or some kind of routine activity, like buying food/clothes, eating snack etc. it's totally different from what I described above.
 
but anyway even though I disagree on your poor choice of words I still tried to censor my post above but the site wouldn't let me :( so please accept my sincere apology for this

blessthejon says:

I'm 16, and I'm on this site all the time. Does that count?

shmuntz says:

well, I wouldn't consider 16 yo a kid who can't read this kind of stuff (when I was 16 I knew all these intimate things about men and women in great detail so nothing in that post would be news or shocking to me at that time, seriously), but if you were 12 yo then yeah I'd be definitely burned right here LOL :)

Posts don't need pictures to be graphic in nature.

Nickkk101 says:

I'm going to give this a +1 just because i feel sorry for him.
 

shmuntz says:

this joke about giving +1 to posts which is technically impossible is actually a good feature request for admins of this site, I second that. admins please give us a way to +1 posts, thank you!

schlubadub says:

I agree with the sentiment, even though it is a bit TMI ;) However, it is true that some girls get bad cramps and will tear your head off if you go near them... So it's not just a blood thing. But hey, if she's in the mood it shouldn't stop you :)

Aldoron says:

That...was the most random comment string I have read...to date...

DaiaX says:

Oh well .. as long as MS release WP8 and WP 7.8 on time and have a really- really - wow factor.

1jaxstate1 says:

I thought they already announced what would be in Window Phone 7.8.

Sasparilla says:

True, unless they want to release in 2013 they shouldn't be trying to define features to design and code at this point....they should be squashing bugs and polishing for a late 2012 release.

schlubadub says:

They've only said the home screen and been cagey on anything else being included or not

They released a list of "known" features. As stated in the article about the latest SDK release, Microsoft still has some hidden features they aren't wanting us to know just yet.

alex6272 says:

Well, it's probably too late for them to go in and add a lot of features to the 7.8 release. They will probably just consider ideas and look at when would be the best time for MS to add them to various releases. I agree with Mr. Edmonds

restlessdan says:

I am still excited for 7.8. And depending on how long after wp8 the 7.8 update comes out it wouldn't effect me anyway as I'll be due my upgrade not long after Christmas.

MikeInBA says:

Thank god.  When i heard they were taking suggestions for 7.8, my first thought was "wait, so they havent even started yet?",  my second thought: "if they have started, and are still in a state where they can throw things in, that means 7.8 wont be out till late spring at the earliest". 

1jaxstate1 says:

Dumb question, engadget has me confused. Will new apps developed for Window phone 8 work on Windows phone 7.8?

dtboos says:

If they are coded specifically for WP8, they will not.
 
Although I expect most developers who do not NEED wp8 native access ect will likely continue to build for 7.5/7.8 as it already has millions of users.

1jaxstate1 says:

Cool deal, that's what I was thinking. 

schlubadub says:

Unfortunately the current API is severely crippled in many areas, so you will quickly see WP8-only apps that use the new API

migueltoro says:

And that's why you shouldnt trust again in MS with windows phone 8. They're a software company and they dont give software for free. What you think is gonna happen in a year? ask a WM 6.5 or WP 7.5 user...

Curtieson says:

Seeing as they publicly stated you will get updates for 18 months, I'd guess in a year that WP8 people will get an update.
Source: knowing the converstion that there are 12 months in one year.

Yes, but for all we know the last six months of updates for WP8 could be updates equivalent to 7.8. While everyone else will get the next generational shift to WP9. Let's hope not, but if history is any indicator, that's exactly what will happen.

fraddy says:

If MS do that and they probably will, 99% of those who post here will say they love it, instead of pressurising MS to give them more... Some people think very differently to the way I think - I want to get as much as possible paying as little as possible, especially to companies with loads of money... =)

shmuntz says:

"I want to get as much as possible paying as little as possible, especially to companies with loads of money"
 
How's your pirated Windows doing? Enjoying your free stuff much huh? ;)

lippidp says:

It's not likely they will be changing the kernel until the next version of Windows, if even then.  I think from here on it's smooth sailing as far as in-place upgrades go.

TJWINS says:

I agree!  Iphone 3GS, 4, 4S, and 5 will all receive the iOS 6 update and I bet Microsoft is preparing the same idea with Windows Phone.  Since Windows for desktop is written with the NT kernel one would assume that the only way the Windows Phone Kernel would change again is if Windows for desktop is changed and I don't see that in the near future.  I think Micosoft is seeking consistency similar to Apple rather than fragmentation similar to Android.  They have mentioned before that they want a consistent user experience.  I don't think 7.5 users not being able to upgrade to WP8 will happen again unless the kernel is changed so I do expect WP8 phones to receive WP9 and WP10 updates assuming those future OSs are written with the NT kernel.  I hope I'm right but I have no reason to believe otherwise.

fraddy says:

Was there a radical change of kernel between 6.5 and 7? No. There's no way WP8 will be allowed to be upgraded to WM9. And physical boot blockers described here the other day will ensure it is not done unofficially either. within about 1-1.5 years owners of Lumia 920 will be practically forced to buy a new phone to get a new WP OS. Ask owners of WP 6.5 devices

shmuntz says:

That's all lies and BS. Here's why.
 
All WinMobile versions up to and including 6.5 had same kernel and same UI framework, more or less, so naturally upgrades between 4.x, 5.x and 6.x were okay. Then two years ago with 7.x they replaced all UI form scratch from old classic desktop style UI to all new Metro. This change was breaking, no old software could work on new OS without major rewrite hence no easy transition to 7.x and major headache with intorducing platform from scratch essentially.
 
With current transition from 7.x to 8.x they finished building the other half of the OS - the kernel and system frameworks. This is also a breaking change and hence no older hardware is supported with totally new and different kernel, although all the older apps for 7.x are supported, which makes this transition way less painful than from 6.x to 7.x.
 
There will be no such major transitions in the near future, there is NO need to replace Metro with something different and there is NO need to replace NT kernel with something different. Hence with same kernel and UI and other frameworks staying stable and without breaking changes, there are NO hurdles for MS to bring WP9 and WP10 onto the WP8 hardware.
 
For any technically literate person your lies and BS are a funny read but there's no substance to them, fortunately.

Glim12808 says:

At this point that's just pure speculation on your part, but nice try!

Well its better than the alternatives

Rich Edmonds says:

Not sure what you mean. Windows Phone 8 is a complete overhaul of the entire system. It's not a mere "update" to the OS. We've had NoDo, Mango, Tango and the upcoming Windows Phone 7.8 all freely available. So why wont they provide future software updates for free?

Residing says:

I believe the word I used when I posted on the original article was 'ruse' :)
 
Microsoft already knows what it is going to (and not going to) include in WP7.8; I really find it hard to believe that people actually thought that Microsoft was going to implement (and test) features requested on the User Voice site within a few weeks!
 
 

Not a ruse.
What it looks like is that MS would like to know what features people want in a FUTURE update to 7.8.  Why would anyone think that they would be asking about features for an OS they will be releasing shortly???
Chances are, they know exactly what they can and will put in 7.8, and are either finishing it up, or they have started testing it.  
7.8 still has quite of bot of life left in it, due to Nokia wanting to sell cheap phones running Windows.  They are working on a successor to the 610 and will probably release a few more 7.8 devices before they 7.8 is put out to pasture http://www.wpcentral.com/nokia-launch-4-inch-windows-phone-78-lumia-610-...
Plus, I'm hoping that any app developer will try to make their apps 7.8-compatible, unless they truly need the upgraded features that 8 offers.

TJWINS says:

I hope 7.8 is just an update to 7.5 users!  I hope MS does not allow new phones to ship with 7.8 unless they want the fragmentation Android has.  It makes no sense using 7.8 in new phones when WP8 will be a final product.  It will not cost any less to produce new phones with 7.8 vs 8 since the expense is in the hardware.  Microsoft's main goal should be to get WP8 in as many hands as possible if they want to compete and grow against the competition.  It is all about a consistent user experience through the ecosystem with Windows 8, Windows RT, and Windows Phone 8.  MS will be hanging themselves if they allowed new phones to ship with 7.8 instead of 8 and it would go against their objective of producing WP8 in the first place.  Lower end hardware should be able to run WP8 otherwise don't produce lower end hardware.  My 2 cents.

I agree.  I see the low-end phones that Nokia wants to release as a waste of time and resources.  What use is the Lumia 610?  How much less could it have cost due to its 800MHz processor and 256mb of ram, compared to building a Gen 1 Windows phone with 1GHz processor and 512mb of ram?  Sure, a little money was saved, but a lot of money was put towards making WP 7 work on lower-end hardware.  
How much less could the 610 cost?  By the time it came out, the 710 was selling, new and off-contract, for between $200-$250 in Canada, while the 610 started selling in Europe for around 200 (or more) Euros.  
Just imagine all that R&D that went into making Windows Phone 7 more compatible for low-end devices, and now it's almost wasted because Windows Phone 8 is completely different. Also, all those people buying the 610 will not have as good of a user experience as someone using the 710, or even a Gen 1 phone.  Yeah, the 610 runs faster in some ways, but imagine how well it could run with a slight faster processor and double the ram?  Make the screen smaller (3.2 -3.5 isn't THAT bad) to save some money.  You'll make it up with volume AND future sales because you'll have a lot of happy customers.
And now Nokia is planning on releasing a followup to the 610, codenamed Glory (Lumia 620?), which will also have an 800MHz processor and 256 mb of ram, but will come with a larger screen (4inch).  Why go through all that trouble?  If you want to release low-end, low-cost phones, why not just stick with the existing 610, and sell the existing 710 as a higher-end version of it.  The R&D has already been done on the 710, no need to redesign assembly lines or new moulds or anything.  And users of the 710 will be MUCH happier than anyone buying a "newer" 620 (Glory).  
It works for Apple - they just release last year's iPhone as a mid-range model, and the iPhone from 2 years ago as a low-end model.  Many different industries have done that as well.  The Chyrsler Crossfire was a previous generation Mercedes SLK.  If you have a good product, but it is too "old" to fit the current market section, then just re-position it rather than starting from scratch.

RaRa85 says:

I'm so done with trying to keep up with future updates. Microsoft is needs to push the 7.8 update in all its cosmetic glory along with Nokia Maps for non-Lumia users ASAP. If we're not getting alot of new features, don't make us wait for a little polish on an already great OS. If we're getting more than what they're letting on, then the wait is worth it in my opinion. But don't make us(7.5 users) wait til after Christmas when the newcomers are riding their brand new bikes and we get the sweater(if that's ever happened you know the feeling). I mean a sweater will keep you warm and all but it's not as cool as a shiny new bike.lol

ejlee072006 says:

I don't care... Give me the yellow submarine #920

jcagga says:

How about its called windows phone RT??

diapers says:

Some gullible people thought there was more than just the start screen

It did look really weird - UserVoice's big idea is that you vote on suggestions, and they sent me an e-mail saying 'now vote' and I looked at it and thought, wait a second - they did it all via comments - how I am supposed to vote on anything? They may have all sorts of other issues, but the gist of their response is true to what you would do on UserVoice: make each suggestion a separate post so users can have a voice on it.

homeboy11153 says:

I convinced my girlfriend and her brother to get a lumia 900 the day it came out. Here we are in Sept with no real confirmation on all the features coming in the 7.8 and a release date. Its getting harder and harder each day to support you MIcrosoft.  

lippidp says:

You should not support Microsoft.  If you buy their stuff, they should support you.  If you don't like the stuff or don't think MS support is adequate, you should not buy it (or convince others to buy it).  When WP7 came out I didn't get it because it didn't come close to satisfying my needs at the time.  Neither did Apple, Google, or Blackberry so I stayed with my WM 6.5.  WP 7.5 came out and I re-evaluated.  Now it was good and I got one.  Brand loyalty is for fools.  If WP8 is a dog I will not get one of those, either.  So far things look good, though.

w8vi says:

+10  My vote for best comment of the month award.  Brand loyalty is for fools.  I would add "and fanboys!"
 

I agree.  I've had 5 smartphones since 2003 when I got one to avoid carrying my flip phone and a palm pilot.  Every time I've changed operating systems to one that would fit my needs the best.  From my Palm Pilot, to my Sony Ericsson P800 running the UIQ version of Symbian, to a HTC s620 running Windows Mobile 6.1, to my Blackberry Bold 9700, to the HTC Panache running Android (then quickly back to my Blackberry as the Panahe was a lemon), and now my Nokia Lumia 710.
I would have probably bought a Palm Pre when it first came out, but it wasn't available for my carrier of choice.  Same with the iPhone (no compatible with my network).  
There's a good chance that my next phone will be a Nokia Lumia, first time I'll be sticking with the same manufacturer and OS, but I am not in a hurry to do so.  I like Nokia quality, and I really want a phone with Pureview, but I will wait until it trickles down to the mid-range phones (as I buy my phones outright w/o contract).  But I will see where things are a year from now. 

shmuntz says:

I'm just like you man. My story:
 
I tried BB Torch with BB7 first, liked it the most among the phones I tried (iPhone 4, WP 7.0 and some Android 2.x phones), used it for a year, then WP 7.5 came out, I tried it, liked it more than my BB and replaced my Torch 9850 with HTC Titan (I always buy my phones on ebay for cheap without contracts so I can upgrade every year without sinking more than couple of hundred dollars at once).
 
Then after using Titan for a while I tried Galaxy Note with Android 2.3 and it was totally unusable crap although the screen was the best phone screen I saw in my life, way way better than any other phone offered including iPhone 4S and everything else. Then later I tried Galaxy Note with Android 4.0.4... and IMMEDIATELY replaced Titan with Note. The Android 4.0.4 was THAT good, light years above 2.3 crap that Samsung installed on it by default.
 
So now I'm a happy Android 4.0.4 user on the best phone hardware out there, Galaxy Note (I rate screen size, resolution and quality above all other metrics in the phone hence it's the best for me, YMMV if you prefer smaller screen/faster CPU like in iPhone 5 or smth else) but I'm watching WP8 closely, since Android's UI is still ugly laggy crap compared to WP 7.5 so if Samsung ever makes 5" phone with 1280x800 screen like my Note with WP8 on it I'll be dumping Android IMMEDIATELY.
 
So I'm here with ya bro in saying NO to dumb brand whores ;)

Xaphoon148 says:

WHAT!!!
I want screenshot, Bluetooth with file sharing, on the air transfere of files, USB, abs, psp, ABC, wc, airbag, ast, beer cooler,... and a Lumia 920 for Christmas in the 7.8 update...

UltimateKGB says:

What about ESP

Xaphoon148 says:

Most definitely want esp as well :-) soon to be winter here.
Ice on the windshield this morning... Brrr...
thank you for the reminder :-)

Narr says:

It was obvious that 7.8 is finished featurewise.

Ummm.... no.
MS and/or Nokia will be adding that filters feature in the camera app, and Nokia and Microsoft will be adding features to it as well. 
Basically whatever feature they can port from WP 8 that doesn't need the updated WP 8 hardware they'll try to bring over.  Nokia will continue to sell WP 7.8 phones worldwide in the middle of their high-end 920/820 and low-end Asha lineup.  The added benefit to Microsoft is that the early adopters will not be completely left behind.

shmuntz says:

"whatever feature they can port from WP 8 that doesn't need the updated WP 8 hardware they'll try to bring over"
 
yeah maybe they will try but they will fail for almost every seriously interesting and worthwhile new software-only feature like IE10 because those really interesting/cool features like IE10 with all the whizbang of HTML5 etc can't be ported NOT because of hardware (single core 1.5 GHz Qualcomm chip from old WP7 phone like HTC Titan is more than enough for it) but becaue of SOFTWARE.
 
IE10 has too many dependencies on the new kernel and system frameworks. it's just waaaay too much effort to port such a huge amount of code to the different kernel and different system frameworks. same could be said about all the other features - because kernel and new system API is so different in desktop NT compared to ancient windows compact kernel the price of porting most interesting/heavyweight stuff (IE10 etc) from WP8 to WP7 is prohibitively high.
 
because of that you can safely expect MS giving you some breadcrumbs from their table like that start screen but not MUCH else. some minor features will be probably ported back to WP7 _IF IT IS CHEAP ENOUGH TO PORT THEM_ but the real deal like IE10 is tied to new kernel and new OS frameworks way too much to make such a port to WP7 plausible from the resource/man-hour/money investment point of view.
 
sorry to burst your bubble, I'd LOVE to see those cool features ported back to WP7 but alas, economy/money is a bitch. MS is much more focused on catching up to iPhone/iOS than on supporting some small group of fringe users.
 
_IF_ windows phone 7 were sold in HUGE amounts then yeah I believe MS would not dare to dump its existing user base. but compare dumping 10 million of users with dumping like 200 million of users. 10 milliions is nothing, not worth SERIOUS investment in porting big features from WP8 to WP7.
 
I'd love to be proven wrong, really! but so far the reality is following my predictions, unfortunately :(

peterjr1boom says:

Brilliant, us Lumia 800/900 users are being so freaking cheated. I hope Nokia helps us users who only got our phones 4/7 months ago.

mans550 says:

The Question I have is will developers end up making 2 version of their app and will there be now 2 versions of the same app on the the market? One for WP8 and one for WP7.8???

inteller says:

you can set your app target to 7.8/8 and it will limit your environment to only those APIs both support.  What I'd most like is an expanded set of APIs at 7.8 so that developers will be inclined to set their target as 7.8/8  If devs start seeing too many delicious APIs they want to use that are 8 only then 7 app releases will drop off quickly.

kinaton says:

Lol Nokia don't care.. They have your money

Got some freaky and nasty people around here lmao!!!

judas2100 says:

I dont think windows 7.8 or even windows 8 will make any difference. The apps in marketplace suck. I can name at least 20 popular apps not in marketplace. Not to mention whats available is over priced. Ms is not introducing glass effect to tiles which is hindering user experience. And yes there is more but my money is wasted. So the best thing to do is act like you havent made the worst decision of your life by opting for a windows phone over android. So looking for new windows 7.8(not)

Xaphoon148 says:

Jumping to WP 7.5 I think was a very good decision, going with WP to 8 seems like a excellent decision compared to the alternatives :-)
And aren't really missing apps in marketplace...
Life is also so many other wonderful things... :-)

What are you guys, MS's pawns?

Xaphoon148 says:

Ah, angry little one ey...?

wpos8 says:

I dont care about 7.8 I would just get a windows phone 8 without need for an upgrade

rceballos10 says:

It's amazing how MS like to take 2 steps forward and leaps back! SMH!  Really... who the F is over there working on their marketing and public relations! WOW!

Denyerec says:

Where DO we post feedback? I for one would like the keyboard to require a press and HOLD to switch keyboard layouts. I've lost count of the number of times I've switched to the Chinese keyboard halfway through a text message... :(

andreisza says:

I'm so sick of all this confusion and speculations, microsoft are so freakin pathetic! What is with these secrets and misteries? I think that even they just don't know what they're doing. They are so wrong and unprofessional. Microsoft has to open their eyes to what Apple are doing, they can turn a shit into gold. Godamnit!