Microsoft unveils Windows Phone 7.8 update for current hardware

WP Central

Microsoft's Windows Phone 7.8

The question of what Microsoft would do for those current Windows Phone users who have generation 1 and generation 1.5 devices like the HTC Titan or the highly popular Nokia Lumia 900 for Windows Phone 8 has finally been answered.

Windows Phone 8’s main features involve new hardware like multi-core processors, NFC and higher resolution displays. Phones like the Lumia 900 cannot take advantage of these new features but Windows Phone 8 also brings additional changes to the Start screen which current users can take advantage of.

In able to ensure that current customers have the best and latest from Microsoft, the company is officially offering Windows Phone 7.8 as an OS upgrade. Windows Phone 7.8 will still be based on the CE kernel and won’t enable advanced Windows Phone 8 features like app and games that use native programming, but it will give current users the new Start screen and appearance of Windows Phone 8.

The new Start screen in Windows Phone 8 has three new elements, including

  • Variable tile sizes, including user customizable selection between small, medium and so-called “double wide” tiles
  • Removal of the “gutter” aka “the gap” known as the off-centered space to the right of the Start screen. The gutter was a carry-over from the Zune days but now Tiles will be evenly distributed on the Start screen
  • New tile colors – yes, while the 10 + 1 model of Accent colors for Windows Phone carried us for nearly two years, Windows Phone 8 and Windows Phone 7.8 will offer a wider selection of colors

Although not being able to directly upgrade to the new NT kernel of Windows Phone 8 may be a bit of a letdown for current users, the Windows Phone 7.8 upgrade should offer new Windows Phone users nearly the same experience considering their lack of advanced hardware.

Update: Nokia just announced Play To DLNA support, Counters for data information, Nokia Music 3.0 and Camera Extras for all current Lumia phones

Do you think it’s a fair compromise and are you satisfied? Let us know in comments.

WP Central



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jdevenberg says:

Unless they come up with a way for my Lumia 900 to keep getting new apps,  no I'm not satisfied.  I've been using WP7 since the day the HD7 launched on T-Mobile, and now my Lumia 900, which will be approx. 6 months old when WP8 comes out, will likely not get any additional updates beyond 7.8 and will see few new apps.  Why did I leave Android again?  

Im_On_One says:

Would you rather not get an update at all? Stop being an entitled brat

fogel35 says:

This isn't being an entitled brat.  This is watching the "ecosystem" getting splintered into people with a robust app selection to a dead end ecosystem.  That screeching halt you heard, was development for Windows CE/7.5 apps.  Micrsoft could always compound their mistake by throwing good money after bad money to try to keep 7.5's ecosystem on life support but what company is stupid enough to do that? 

Im_On_One says:

The ecosystem will be fine, who cares about apps? Integrated features are better

Auric Jarrel says:

Why did you buy a lumia so soon? I've had my HD7 since launch and still have it. Know why? Because I know the hardware our phones have can only do so much and I knew by the time WP8 came out that I would want a device that could support everything it had to offer.

chall3ng3r says:

Man!!! MS should have supported at least 2nd Gen WP devices with 1.4+GHz processors.
Also so far no mention of some kind of notification center, so all missed notifications of not tiled apps can be seen.
MS, listen to the users!!!
// chall3ng3r //

1101x10 says:

This is bad for existing customers. You will get a bit of window dressing but the core feature which is native code is missing. So apps will be easier to be ported from other systems but you won't be able to run them. The excuse that existing devices can't run win8 is BS. The iPhone 3GS can run iOS5 and thats single core with 256mb of memory. Microsoft has shafted it's customers again.

Im_On_One says:

We are not shafted, would you rather not get an update at all?

Ticomfreak says:

Nope. You fail to realize that WP8 has a new kernel, while iOS 1-6 have never changed the kernel

Thamuz says:

Exactly. The only thing you can say is that it is unfortunate that they chose to change the kernel but if it has to be done, I'd rather have it sooner than later. No matter at which point they did it, changing the kernel would always be a pita but all in all I think current users are off just fine.

They need to pay for peoples with 2nd gen devices upgrades fees $200 would be a nice start

Mio_Ray says:

This is fine by me. At least some apps for wp8 will also run on Wp7.8. You can't make an omelet without breaking a few eggs.

Really looking forward to the update hitting mu NL800 :)

walnutcrunch says:

This is not technically correct. WP7 apps written in Silverlight/XNA will also run on WP8. Apps written for WP8 are written in WinRT/DirectX, which won't run on WP7.8. While it's true that developers can target Silverlight/XNA when they write new apps, chances are they will target WinRT instead to get a common code base between Win8 and WP8. New apps support on WP7.8 looks bleak, IMHO as a developer.

samuch says:

Lumia 900 owner and pissed. If there wasn't a complete divide of app support id be fine with just not being able to install apps that use NFC and so on. But no, this screws us.

rceballos10 says:

You'll be fine. Nokia will still be updating their phones to get as much as the wp8 experience as possible.

mjfadaway says:

I have a Lumia 900, and I think this approach is fair by Microsoft. So im not upset, but will be selling my phone for an Apollo device. Cheer up guys. This was the only way! At least they acknowledged us. They didn't have to do anything.

mythos13 says:

It's exaclty what I expected. I wanted to buy an unlocked cyan Lumia 900 to run on Bell knowing that it would likely not get the full WP8 but I was not able to get one. I guess I'll wait for WP8 now but I still wouldn't rule out buying an unlocked Lumia 900 in cyan to do me becuase that is how much I want to move on from my HD7.

scottcraft says:

I think it's fair. It would be nice to get everything on the current phones, but some is better than nothing.

pavvento says:

I'm ready for a bit of a conspiracy since I love them...WP8 gets a ton of press in the next few days with the caveat that current phones can't upgrade but will get 7.8.  In a week or so Nokia announces that the upgrade will work (just not NFC) with the 900 giving their sales a shot in the arm.  Now if I only had a magic bullet...

paschott says:

If only that turns out to be the case.... Would definitly make Lumia owners a bit happier and I could totally do without NFC support right now.  I can deal with missing the hardware security for wallet, too. Wait and see for several months down the road, I guess. :(

MistaWet says:

Before I spend on a new device, I will invest in a new Surface tablet. My phone provides me with more than enough data and features. Anything else is a bonus.

The new WP8 apps won't work on current devices, right? So we are left out of the ecosystem from now on?

zacman says:

Yes, it is a burning platform now.
And what's worse it's not only bout new apps but also about updates for existing apps.
Because lets face it: Most developers will port their existing WP7 apps to WP8 RT framework which is inompatible with WP7's silverlight framework but works on WP8 as well as WindowsRT 8 and Windows 8. So porting to RT framework makes lots of sense for developers. And then the developers basically have to maintain two different platforms for updates: silverlight and RT. And silverlight only has about 2% marketshare but RT is the future.
So I'm pretty sure that after maybe 6 months developers will just quit supporting also the silverlight framework with updates as this is a lot of more work but generates very little income compared to the RT framework.
So future updates for poular apps (like WhatsApp for example) will only appear for WP8.

Miistercoool says:

I hope 7.8 gets the Nokia maps too :O

texantony says:

i think it's fair. I understand that new technology that works with new hardware is not going to completely work for my phone. The hardware is not there, but I'm glad quite a bit of features including the new start screen will be part of older phones. 
Most people are stuck with contracts but I'm pretty sure deals will rise. 
I'm actually very excited about windows 8 now. Time to start saving.

I can see why this has come about, after all current windows phones dont have the hardware thats needed for Windows Phne 8 many new features. Its ok for many early adopters, but not good for people in the last 6 months have purchased a new Lumia device for example...Though the OS will get upgraded and look and feel like Windows 8, you will soon find that you are not getting the apps that will become more available, nor VOIP stuff....
Oh well, my upgrade is November, perfect timing... 

Gaiking says:

This is fine with me. We can't expect an updated OS to take advantage of hardware that our phones simply don't have.

Mr4eyes86 says:

So we won't be able to download new apps made for wp8 when it's released later this year on our current handsets?

paschott says:

Lumia 900 owner as well and pretty disappointed. Seeing the multitasking feature now and knowing that there's no native code support in this partial upgrade makes me think that this is a pretty limited upgrade. Even their casual game from Big Fish seemed to require the new code support so what does that say about existing users?
I completely understand not being able to support the hardware dependent features, but losing the things that are really software dependent hurts quite a bit. Definitely will hold off on upgrading my wife's phone as she'll love some of those new features. For me, my next phone will likely be bought at full price because MS isn't quite giving us everything we need for existing customers.
I do appreciate that the update will supposedly be pushed in a way that bypasses the carriers, though. That's a nice touch.

jaybee says:

Kind of a drag to not get new apps when devs start using the new SDK, but I install a new app on average once every few weeks. This is a much better solution than what Palm/HP did to original Pre owners. In that situation, the company went public saying that all legacy devices would get the next OS version. A few months later, they reversed and said there would be no upgrade path for legacy devices. They really screwed a lot of people and they knew it, which is why they tried to "make it right" by offering a $50 credit on the TouchPad.
I think most people know full well that when they buy a phone there's a good chance it will lose support at some point. Look at Android for an example. Most users are still on an operating system that is 2 versions old. There is now talk about version 5 being released while version 4 is only available to a few handsets. I'll gladly take this scenario over waiting a year for an update only to hear that the OEM or carrier won't push the update. As long as Nokia keeps improving the firmware for the 900, I'll be happy.

This is a fine compromise. A large part of the commenters on this thread and over at The Verge need to stop their whinning. Did you really expect to get full WP8 when they are making massive HARDWARE changes? we will get the software changes for the most part, which is better then nothing at ALL, which is exactly what most android phones get. 
I don't hear all the bitching and whinning going on with android when they release a phone, that is outdated in a few months when a OS upgrade comes out that they won't get.

invertme says:

I bought my 900 fully expecting not to get WP8. I plan to buy a WP8 phone right when they come out too! I'll give my 900 to the woman or my daughter.
I knew Microsoft wouldn't abandon the platform either. Honestly if upgrading existing phones to WP8 would hold the platform back I would be much less happy than how it turned out.

AdamG2468 says:

Good point and in all honesty I will be getting the WP8 when it comes out also...

Shobiz says:

When I broke my contract ($180). I switch from Sprint (HTC Arrive) to AT&T for the Lumia. I knew then I would get a WP8. I'll just wait for what ever Nokia comes out with. It will probably come after Christmas anyway. Shot...I wasted more money on stuff that I can't show. At least this something I will carry around everyday.

ubuntuai says:

And who says there won't be custom wp8 roms for the Legacy devices?

bsmerl says:

Bad for me...i just got my phone and it is now a legacy device... Hard to wait 18 more months for the new OS. Guess wp7 device sales will now plummet due to this announcement.

AdamG2468 says:

Well, this is a huge let down. Lets face it. Lumia 900 users should be disappointed...

rebinoh says:

Why? Did the specs of the L900 promise multicore support or higher resolution support or the ability to change kernels? I don't think so.
Hardware upgrades come with new capabilities. I think people were expecting too much from their current devices which were never mentioned or promised.
Nokia has been "johnny on the spot" in addressing problems with their current devices by acknowledging the concerns of the user and issuing fixes for them as soon as they were able. How many iOS or Android users can claim that?
My significant other is still waiting for ICS for their Galaxy Note and Xoom tablet. Even after writing Google a number of times.
This compromise is suitable for me right now until I'm able to upgrade to a newer device. And depending on what other features I'll receive OTA, I may hold off altogether.
It's not like you all have buyer's remorse because none of the older models are receiving any type of update. Let's just wait to see what the update brings before issuing condemnations for MS & Nokia.

ncxcstud says:

So, what's better?  Being offered an update that is numbered slightly different from the next big upgrade (WP7.8) or being offered an updated titled WP8 that doesn't get you all the 'goodies' of WP8?  Basically one route is what Microsoft is doing, the other is what Apple does (if I'm understanding their update philosophy).
I prefer being given AN update for my almost 2 year old Focus, that doesn't tout itself to be 'all' of what WP8 does, as opposed to being given a WP8 'update' with a bunch of asterisks of what my phone cannot do.
Stinks for L900 users though....

dkp23 says:

For me, i knew the risk going in, so i am not bothered so much.  I just hope we get ScreenShot. 

Totally agree with this summary although as a brand new l800 owner I am still happy.

yosagojimbo says:

How can any WP7 user recommend their Lumia to any user (other than to try sell it on),
Nokia and MS have wasted a ton of advertising money on the Lumia range, I wonder if it was to shift a warehouse full of shite legacy handsets that no-one will want to buy as the support will stop when WP8 comes out

dkp23 says:

For me, i didnt recommend the phone to my friends.  I told them to wait for wp8. 
No need to recommend a phone that i know may not get fully supported with an upgrade, i'd be lying to them.  I like my lumia and that is good enough for me.  My friends asked about my phone and was consdiering getting one.  I said if you want, but i told them to wait. 

Ambrose99 says:

Easy. The Lumia 900 is still a great phone. Win 8 may be better, but that doesn't diminish my excellent experience. At this point, I'd probably say to hold off as long as they can for 8, but if they must upgrade NOW due to a broken phone or what have you, I still would pick my Lumia 900 over Android or iOS. 

Odog4ever says:

No. Just no.
Nokia/MS are building a brand. They have gotten nothing but good press from the Lumia line. If you think a new Lumia that runs WP8 won't be there at launch you are crazy.
It's just like Verizon did with the Droid line. Do you think they tell customers when they walk in the store that a new phone in the Droid line is only 3-6 months away? No, they don't.
Even iphones keep selling after the yearly announcement of a new hardware revision. Why? Because people always need phones and may not be able to wait for a certain time frame, or they don't keep up with tech news (Which is most people).

naset says:

No problem guys..we still have xda-developers ;-)
Remember the old htc hd2? Our legacy phone will get the apollo xda-dev way. :)

I have no problem with not having 8 if 7.8 looks the same and the vast majority of apps will work. I might miss out on the latest and greatest games but that is progress. The .net apps will work just fine so I'm happy.

It's a very big task running two different versions so hats off to MS for the update but I suppose it is what they are very good at. The appeal of a shared kernal between tablets, pcs and phones is very appealing!

jrico says:

I'm ok with it.  It used to be you had to buy a whole new phone to get any new features.  Upgradable phones are a fairly recent phenomena.  Plus, my current HTC Trophy does everything I need it to right now.  Waiting another year to upgrade to a Windows 8 phone just doesn't bother me.  I have a great phone right now that will get me though the wait.

smasithick says:

Genuine decision made by Microsoft for legacy devices

migueltoro says:

Hey Nokia!!!! How is this different from Symbian??? Ecosystem with no apps in the future. If i lived in Espoo I'd be throwing my lumia to Nokia Headquarters. Don't buy lumia should be trending topic. No matter what everybody says I feel deeply betrayed and I'm sure I'm not the only one. 

I disagree - .net apps will be compatible and thus the majority of apps will work.

migueltoro says:

"majority of the apps" Should I feel o.k. with majority with a brand new phone? And don't tell me I'm an idiot because I didn't wait, here in Europe when your contract is over it's over and you get a new phone (at least in spain), Ooops did I say a new phone, I meant a "legacy" phone. Yes I'm pissed and hope nokia goes bankruptcy. To be honest, all I wanted is a decent whatsapp, skype, IM+ or any other instant messagin' experience and with no native support I'm not gonna get it. If I was ugly and with no GF, I'd be cryin'. It's symbian all over again.

mangoose says:

I doubt windows8/wp8 apps will run on 7.8, since its altogether a different kernel. The 7.8 update may still be a CE kernal, unlike w8/wp8's NT kernel.
The only sure thing right now is that you'll get to resize tiles in 7.8.

foosball says:


What about those of us who want to upgrade our Android devices to WP8? Is that going to be WP 7.9? Ha,ha.

Im_On_One says:

Very idiotic thing to say

foosball says:

Thank you. Coming from you that means a lot.

How's your Swype keyboard doing?

Im_On_One says:

Don't need it dumbfuçk

weepatc says:

Windowsphone has to move on fast & this is what's happening now. They can't wait until new customers contracts run out before moving forward. That would just not make sense in the dog eat dog mobility world. For those of you who bought the Lumia, why didn't you do as I did & patiently await WP8 & the new devices that will come with it. I know Lumia owners will be pissed but don't say you are not being catered for. I too would have liked a Lumia but it was too big a gamble. It appears now my patience has been rewarded. Bring on WP8!

Ambrose99 says:

Honestly, I didn't wait as I simply couldn't stand my horribly broken (and not rooted) Android. Too many updates killed the device and I couldn't take it anymore. However, I rarely get new apps for my phone now anyway and I'm not a bandwagon app guy, so I really don't mind.
I'm very happy with my Lumia 900 purchase, and still will be when this finally releases. By the time I'm able to upgrade to 8, It'll have all the kinks worked out and most likely be a second or third gen 8 phone, possibly up to 9. I agree with their decision to move forward, I think it's a great move to have Win 8, Xbox Smartglass, and Win Phone 8 all coming around the same time (right in time for the holidays, no less), and am happy they are still going to throw current Win Phone customer a bone. I just hope this bone doesn't ruin our phones either. :) 

chatscc says:

Quite good. What about the wi-fi auto sleep.?

sdreamer says:

Think the biggest problem for current owners is missing out on more app support, especially those that can run in background. I don't see why Microsoft can't invest a little more and put the kernel on existing devices even if we can't take advantage of multicore and NFC at least we could have the same apps, or at least some of the apps; like what they did with Tango. It is really annoying to think that next year WP8 users may have popular apps like Instagram while WP7.8 users can't even run it because of the kernel and what that brings over. That's what bugs me the most. I think Microsoft should seriously think it through and at least offer 50$ credit or something to recent purchasers. I think with this news out there were going to see a drop of app support and also sales. Who in their right mind would offer a WP7.5 device now when WP8 is around the corner, definitely no sales associate would advocate that. The 7.8 update is nice, buy it just isn't the right solution.

nablor says:

FU Microsoft you just lost a loyal follower, you have just made all current WP handsets ffing worthless , just got my titan and seriously pissed off fu fu fu.

timwp12 says:

Be quiet cry baby has go ahead leave and go for other crappy phones. What you worried you will get same windows phone look

nablor says:

The same ffing look won't make the ffing apps for wp8 work will they .

ousooner314 says:

With 7.8, you're really getting all of the features that are non-hardware related. The stuff left out are things that wouldn't work on your phone anyway. Hope this helps make you feel a little better.

chadwick611 says:

Glad I didn't upgrade I had a feeling this was going to happen.

Ambrose99 says:

I'm very okay with it. It sounds like they're doing everything they possibly can without ruining the phone, which is a lot more than I can say about Apple and Android.
I had an Android Galaxy S that started with Eclair. It ran fine. They threw it an upgrade to Froyo, that slowed it down considerably and made the OS more unstable. They threw an upgrade to Gingerbread, and it essentially killed the device, only 20 months after I had it.
To be honest, I never expected them to throw an OS designed for better hardware onto older phones. They want Everyone's experience to be great, and MS just seems to KNOW better than that. I would much rather prefer this than Apple's "latest upgrade now says your phone is 4G, when it still has a 3G radio installed and we don't offer a 4G phone yet" shenanigans.
In this day and age, as I've learned from experience, never expect and be very wary of upgrades. If your phone isn't desgined for it, it may behoove you to stick with your current version. If they offer an upgrade that works perfectly with your phone, well thats just a bonus, not an expectation. 
MS - Please don't have this update mess with how slick my 900 is. I really enjoy it and don't want to see it messed up. 

nevzy101 says:

So my hd7 is fucking useless then pissing Microsoft again fuckwits

Im_On_One says:

Calm down, you get the same features, what's your problem

ousooner314 says:

You'll get to enjoy all the features your phone can support. Anything left out is stuff that won't run anyway.

grimmethod says:

Really? You're complaining that your HD7 which isn't even made by HTC anymore is not getting brand new hardware features and software? Your phone is far from useless and there's no way you can have an HD7 without being pretty close to an upgrade because the phone has been on life support for awhile now.

schlubadub says:

Boohoo you've only got 2 years of enjoyment out of it, and it will continue to work for years to come. It may not get all the awesomeness of WP8, but it will still work as a phone, still connect to the internet and still have 100,000+ apps available to it.

phil.rick says:

I'd say this is sufficient. I mean, there will obviously be hardware limitations, so it's nice to see they're trying to bring as much as possible to the older devices.

david126 says:

When is it available Dan? Any word from MS?

laserfloyd says:

It's fair enough.  I think people buying 1.5 phones should get a major discount or ability to upgrade for free though.  I'd be pissed if I'm a 900 buyer knowing that in 3 or so months, it's that badly dated.  Will be waiting for a full on WP8 device for sure.

dortyboy says:

U mean I am stock in a 2yr contract and not be able to upgrade and take advantage. I am really pissed at MS. They are just being greedy. Knowing that the phones would need dual core it should have been installed long before

david126 says:

Oh oh, I see an ocean of windows 7 devices on Craigslist!

timwp12 says:

Yes I agree and can't wait for wp 7.8 upgrade

CobaltDragon says:

I am excited about WP again, finally. I think giving us 7.8 for current devices is a good enough way of killing off WP7 devices, and most likely they won't have to do this again since this new architecture is more modern and flexible and should hopefully lead to an upgrade system more similar to Apple's for the iPhone.
I will be happy to upgrade my HTC Radar to 7.8 and live on that for a while until a really nice WP8 phone is available - one I'll be happy with for a year or two.

olasuneri says:

That is it!
I will be glad too to upgrade my Radar to 7.8 and wait for a great WP8.

asmanthebell says:

Slap in the balls really, cheers for the 7.8 offer how about ram it and give me WP8 can't believe my brand spanking new Lumia is already classed as a legacy device. But hell im stuck with this on contract. So might as well get on with it. Anyway how about a mobile version of surface device?

timwp12 says:

everyone here Mad be quiet at least Microsoft has not forgotten current users. Also at least we will get same new look of windows 8

dabs1710 says:

Hate!!! Microsoft: U r doing ur best to loose me as a loyal customer..

olasuneri says:

It's just fair enough, the company has to move forward Os wise, hardware wise and resolution wise. We too just have to upgrade either now or sometimes in future.
Overall, I am impressed with what Microsoft is doing lately.

ousooner314 says:

I, being a gen 1 Focus owner,  think this is a good compromise because there are certain things that are just not possible with older gen hardware. However, I can also understand the frustration from the Lumia and other newer gen owners because only a few months into owning the product, they now have a device that cannot fully upgrade to WP8. I think most of the frustration will be resolved if they manage to offer natively written apps in a format that's compatible with current phones. I truly feel this would appease the masses.

4ty-phive says:

Well put fellow sooner fan

ousooner314 says:

Boomer Sooner! :)

chuckdaly says:

Any tech blog/site should revise their reviews of current WP7 devices and caution consumers to not buy them.  While its silly for poeple like original Samsung Galaxy Tab owners to cry about not getting ICS,  it isn't unreasonable for people to expect their newly launched device to work with a 6 month software update.  Microsoft just created an ecosystem that leaves current WP7 users out (Sorry leaves them with a new Launcher).  So most of the marketshare gained by new WP7 users can be potentionally lost when their phone contract is up.  I don't know who this is worse for, new lumia 900/ Titan II buyers or Microsoft.  
If one doesn't buy a Windows 8 tablet or computer before their phone contract is up, what is holding them back from switching platforms?  For the record, I own a Lumia 900 that I purchased from ebay, and am due for a phone upgrade through my carrier in January.

soulzero says:

So The Nokia Comercials were right... The SmartPhone Beta test is over... Anyone who uses a Windows Phone 7.5 Device was just beta testing for Windows Phone 8...!!!
I was planning on getting a WP8 Device anyways....

Im_On_One says:

Knew this was going to happen and I'm not upset about it and plan to buy a WP8 anyway but everyone else needs to shut the fúck up and be glad you're at least getting an update.

mogipogi says:

Goodbye MicroSOFT. I'm definitely going to Iphone after I brick my lumia 800. You guys disappoint me once again.

Yes, because Apple's support for old hardware is SOOOO much better. Just because they say you get iOS5 doesn't actually mean you get all of iOS5.

penetronn says:

I know how you feel. I was upset too when Apple told me that my iPhone 3G couldn't support voice control or record video with iOS 3.0. That's why I'm a WP7 user now actually. Unfortunately, I've come to the realization that this is the new normal when it comes to technology. Shelf lives of phones and tablets are going to eventually shrink from years to months. And it's probably only going to get worse as the market gets more competitive. Probably means that the carrier industry needs to rethink the subsidization model as well.

Jakeway says:

I do feel sorry for people that have only just bought their Windows Phone 7.... This is a hard blow for people that have only had their phone for a few months and have a two year contract.
I do hope Microsoft ensure that the apps dont dry up for the Windows Phone 7. 
Still... ensuring there is an update for phone so thats is really good. It means many people can ride out . I am exciting for the update. 
These Windows 8 Phone are still a fair way off. Nokia have wroked hard to bring more to the phone and I am sure they will continue to support WP7 for some time.
Good to know the future will be stable on Windows Phone 8. No fragmentation on Windows Phone 8 :P

ousooner314 says:

The caveat is apps developed specifically for WP8 won't run on WP7.8. I bet unless it really needs to leverage the new hardware, most of the apps will be made to be compatible with WP7.8. This shouldn't be as big an issue as we're making it right now.

jake69 says:

Usually they let you upgrade a little pass one year. I got my 900 at launch....so by the time WP8 launched I only have to wait a few months...no big deal!

RolexDPracer says:

I think it's great. I get a mini update on my HTC Trophy before deciding what Apollo handset I go for.

Targus says:

Personally I use HD7 and don't feel upset about not getting WP8 update. But it definitely hurts Lumia users and Windows Phone's future sale.
It will stop Windows Phone's momentum from now on, and MSFT has to build up the momentum again for WP8 in a more unfriendly market. Furthermore, current users will distrust MSFT with regard to WP's update path. How many people who purchase WP7.5 devices recently with 2-yr contract will believe they won't be screwed again when WP9 is released and happily buy WP8 devices?

Sarang68 says:

Thank goodness we don't have a contract system in India.

Jrexxx says:

7.8 is useless if WP8 apps won't run on it.

Targus says:

Maybe there won't be so many WP8-exclusive apps at least for a while. As long as developers still want the legacy (I hate to use this term) userbase, they will avoid using native code as possible.
However, if Windows 8's strategy suceed (i.e., users do use Metro for most of the time instead of always going back to desktop immediately), WP7.8 userbase will be negligible comparing to billions of Windows Run Time users. At the time, WP7.8 will be completely crippled.

twint7787 says:

I really can't say I'm satisfied until we get the whole list of features legacy device owners aren't getting. A new start screen? Ehh. I'm not going to throw a tantrum like some on here because I'm smart and realized we were probably not getting WP 8. I do sort of kind of feel bad for those who bought a lumia expecting it would be upgradeable but then again you should be diligent in your research when buying a new product. There were so many stories involving the upgrade status of current Gen devices it should have been a red flag. Regardless, I feel that Microsoft is going to run into some hate for this. And probably for the surface rt/pro confusion that is inevitably to follow.

NIST says:

Extremely happy with today's announcement. Hello dual core Windows Phone 8!!!!

schlubadub says:

I wish they'd have said more about what we will and won't be getting in 7.8. I thought Kevin Shields was going to enlighten us, but instead he crapped on about Nokia some more. Yes, I know he's from Nokia but I wanted to hear how it will affect the vast majority of us NOT on Nokia phones.

schlubadub says:

Multi-core, microSD, and NFC are obviously limited by hardware - but will we get IE10, Nokia Maps integration (for non-Nokia phones), and native code apps?

schlubadub says:

The article says native code apps aren't coming... but I didn't hear that in the presentation?

I'm going to be honest, as big of a fan that I am of WindowsPhone(Currently rocking the Cyan Nokia Lumia 900), I am not liking this "new" home screen at all.

schlubadub says:

That's fine - you can keep it looking exactly the same as WP7. It won't affect you at all.

Neo Nuke says:

agreed. i want my off-centre and arrow back

BK-one says:

Simple solution to that. after you update, Make all icons size "LARGE".
You will feel like you never updated as far as the home screen layout goes.

david126 says:

Lumia 900 owners! Did we really expect an upgrade to Apollo after reading the device specs? Yes and no, but it's still a solid device. Glad I bought mine off contract but after having all those issues w the capacitive buttons, purple hue I have learned my lesson to wait before adoption. Sigh..

mvierling says:

This announcment means nothing for AT&T customers.  We all know AT&T will not deliver any updates on their Windows phone.  My HTC Titan is missing 3 updates since January that AT&T will not release.

vmjoaquim says:

I believe this update will be a combo one? :D

ousooner314 says:

According to Engadget - "The update will be delivered directly to users, sidestepping carriers, and can be done over WiFi.".
Link: http://www.engadget.com/2012/06/20/microsoft-unveils-windows-phone-7-8-f...

fluxx says:

That's it Microsoft. I have defended this plattform long enough. You forced all manufactures to stick to one processor for what? Nothing. I bought an Optimus 7 in 2010, I bought an Lumia 800 in 2011. Guess what I will get next? An iPhone. At least Apple get their updates right and I know I invest money in a phone that won't be outdated in a few months. 
I don't care about the 7.8 update, I just read that new apps may not be backwards compatible. I can't believe they are so stupid to create a new plattform just to throw over everything with the next version. I thought otherwise but this company is really directed by monkeys.

schlubadub says:

Seeya! Don't let the door hit your arse on the way out!

fluxx says:

I'm not a hater: I like Windows Phone, I like my Lumia and I defended this plattform again and again. I rant because I think it's stupid to build up a new plattform like they did with Windows Phone 7 and then change everthing again (under the hood) with the next version. Do they really know what they do in the long term?

schlubadub says:

I think the reality is that they did know this 3 years ago, when they wanted to do WP7. The problem was that W8 was still 3 years away and they needed to get their WP platform up and running sooner than later. They only had Windows CE to work with and so that's what they launched a year later. All of the advanced features, even multi-core CPU's, would have to wait until W8 kernel was ready. Now 2 more years on the W8 platform is finally ready to be rolled out across the board - mobiles, tablets, PC's, Xbox's all unified on one platform. 
I want WP8 because I want it to work with everything else that I have, or will own (Xbox, PC, possibly tablet). I will never own a Mac or an iPad, so the iPhone has absolutely no appeal to me.
It's an exciting time - the amount of apps available that will be available has absolutely exploded. The transition for a developer between Xbox and PC has been around for years - but now it's Xbox + PC + Tablet + Mobile. iOS & Android developers can port their existing apps to all of them at the same time... it's going to be VERY hard for developers to ignore and not to do everything they can to get on board.

ousooner314 says:

You should understand that developers are more than likely going to support WP 7.8 and WP 8. Let's wait for more details to come through before jumping to conclusions.

Im_On_One says:

Good luck getting a fully functional iOS update. Have fun with the same tired grid of icons and bland looking apps

rceballos10 says:

You can please everyone... Looking forward to WP7.8 & WP8... Awesomeness!

Steve.7 says:

My brand new Lumia 900 will be old and useless soon!! A big thanks to Microsoft and Nokia!! With love, soon to be former windows phone user

ousooner314 says:

It won't be useless at all. If you're worried about app support, you can bet that developers will support WP 7.8 and WP 8. Besides, WP8 won't be released till the end of the year, with WP8 apps mostly likely hitting MarketPlace the year after. By then, your Lumia is already over a year old and nearing upgrade anyway.

kwajr says:

Not sure why the software can't run on older hardware I mean if the chip ain't there it can't use some function should be scaleable plus why not let me do a clean install

Sarang68 says:

I am very happy with my HTC HD7. Just wish Microsoft would detail what features are coming in the 7.8 update besides start screen.

Kon-Aitor says:

I don't think it is that fair, especially as they are still selling current devices at full price, under contract, and leaving most customers unaware. They are still releasing new handsets (like the 610) with no regard for consumers. They are hurting the OEM's and the customers.
Those who purchased a 900 on contract won't be eligible for an upgrade until this time next year, which is ridiculous. Looking back at all the leaked stuff that came out in April regarding this they obviously knew this was their plan yet they decided to sell and market the 900. Either that or they did not tell their OEM's about this and let them spend money and time developing current devices. 
This is either really poor planning by MS or just a dis-regard for their customers, either way those who support the platform the most (get new handsets when they come out) are the ones who are hurt by this.
The proposed compromise is horrible, it puts Dev's in an awkward position and it stifles the growth of the current marketplace. Most developers will switch to the new SDK and will develop for the NT kernels, which means that either app functionality on 7.8 devices will be hit or miss, or those apps just won't exist for us.  
I myself feel cheated, by all this, I am now locked in a 2 year contract, because I wanted to support Nokia and MSFT, won't get many new apps, and look like a jackass to all the people I’ve been convincing to try WP. So thanks MSFT. Unless they offer a hardware upgrade path for customers of phones bought this year(early renewal, discounted renewal price, or something similar), I don't know if I will support them going forward. 
*rant over

DavidinCT says:

Maybe I should be glad Verizon did not get the Lumia 900....because I would be stuck with a outdated phone.
Getting a 7.8 update will be nice and will hold off most users for a while but at it's core, Window Phone 7.8 update is NOT Windows Phone 8.
I am glad I got my HTC Trophy off contract.....

Big Supes says:

Something along the lines of 7.8 is what a lot of people (myself included) thought would happen. Although I dediced to hang on and not upgrade until WP8, I wouldn't be upset owning a Lumia 800/900/Titan II right now. It's a fair deal considering they'll essentially get the WP8 experience. . .

jfa1 says:

Excellent news I like my 900 and giving it the WP8 experience commensurate with current hardware is perfect until I update my phone later once I see Nokia WP8 phones as well as the other oems I will I will determine what device meets my needs

I think what they've done is a great compromise.  Microsoft needs to keep pushing Windows Phone forward to catch up to iOS/Android, so I don't want them expending a large amount of effort to get all the new features on phones that don't have what they need to take advantage of them.  Having the new Start screen is certainly something.  I bought my WP7 phone off of eBay so that if/when Verizon got better Windows Phones this year, I could do my contract at that point.  Verizon seems very interested in Windows Phone 8, so I'm happy about my choice.  I wonder if Santa will be able to fit both a Surface and a WP8 phone in his sack for me this year!

eshy says:

The actual problem is with the TPM chip. someone told me about that issue a few months back but I thought Microsoft will be able to work around it. 
This means the security features mentioned today (mainly for enterprises) are the real reason existing devices won't support WP8. 
They could've released a version without the TPM related features or the NFC features that still delivered all the other additions. just like the release that added support for front facing cameras was released to all devices when most didn't have one

selfcreation says:

I think its fair.. they did the same thing with the last IOS ( more or less)

but do we have a launch date yet?!?!?!?!


eshy says:

This is such a bad move by Microsoft. This platform is just starting to get momentum and you just screwed all existing users and made sure no one buys your devices in the next few months.
At least they announced it early enough to save those people some money.
Forget 7.8 with the start screen. Forget 18 months of updates for thw WP8 device I don't have. If I just got the Lumia 900 you were pushing so hard and I'm stuck with a 2 year contract, why would I stay with you when Apple's ios6 will run on the 3GS? that phone was out before you announced WP7...
What existing users will want is a solution for upgrading, for cheap/or free, to a comparable WP8 device. Otherwise those great ratings on Amazon might start dropping (great phone, but 1 star because it's already obsolete)
With Android, the lack of updates is usually the hardware company's fault. The fragementation there is caused by Google not forcing them to release updates for a window after launch. Here it's Microsoft itself. 
And sure, all the new features will hide that fact since most of the stories on the web will be about the new stuff, but the reality is that for the second time in two years, MS is doing a reboot that hurts existing customers (only difference here is that the marketplace doesn't go back down to 0 apps)
I hope the folks at XDA will help us with some WP8 ROMs for existing devices

ousooner314 says:

"..when Apple's ios6 will run on the 3GS?" - only features that are compatible with the 3gs hardware will run, and I guarantee you the experience will be less than stellar. And this is coming from personal experience when I owned a 3GS and upgraded to iOS 4. The lack of new features didn't matter, the lagginess was unbearable.
Similarly, in this case, all the features will will work on current gen devices are being packaged as WP 7.8. Except in this case, the user experience is also taken into consideration to make sure it looks and feels like WP8.
If you're worried about lack of backward compatibility of apps, now that's a fairly legitimate concern. However, WP8 isn't being released till the end of the year. Even then, you can be sure that developers will support 7.8 and 8, unless they're only trying to leverage new hardware. Even that won't realistically happen until next year. By then, most current Lumia owners will only be months away from an upgrade.
So, bottomline is it shouldn't be as big a deal as we're all making right now.

rogeret says:

Maybe MS should have just called it 8.0 and then people would be happy.  Or maybe they could have done what Apple does and "upgrade" the old phones so they're so slow that they become unbearable.  I bought the 900 in April knowing that this was the likely scenario.  I do not understand the gritting and gnashing of teeth.  AT&T upgrades after 18 months or so and that will put me right in line for the WP9 phones next year.  For now, I have a phone that I love so much more than I ever loved my iPhone.  I would say the childish ranting is irrelevant, but in this case, MS actually does want the younger, less mature people to stay on board.

shawshank87 says:

Wow, last month I decided Windows Phone would be a great development platform.  I paid an early renewal fee and purchased what I thought would be a great investment towards the Microsoft Platform, the Lumia 900.
Now I'm paired with an obsolete phone that I can't even test native WP8 applications on for two years.  I'll be stuck with the simulator when the development environment is released.
Thanks for nothing Microsoft.  I've already put the device on Amazon so I can try to make my early contract termination fee back.  Can't believe I had faith in your support for early adopters.

eshy says:

The lumia 900 isn't really early adopter. it's a 2nd gen device. which makes it being obsolete even worse.
If you're still in the 30 day window, return the phone ASAP...

shawshank87 says:

I'm on day 45 : (

ousooner314 says:

Think about it this way - WP8 won't be released until towards the end of the year. That means it's perfectly realistic to expect developers to support WP 7.8 and WP 8 for quite a while. By the time WP8 specific apps start to gain traction, we should be well into next year. By then, most current new owners will be nearing their upgrade cycle. So, hopefully, this isn't as big a deal as it seems right now because there'll be a long period of time when apps will support WP 7.8 and WP 8. It may offer little consolation, but hope it makes sense!

@ousooner314...Been reading your comments - very reasonable, rational, and logical - wish there were even more comments like yours on every site regarding Windows Phone 8!
I really hope that Daniel and Team weigh in on this in an editorial and echo your sentiments.

vmjoaquim says:

It's not just about the cosmetics, it's about the kernel, the core.

Distrato says:

I'm kinda in a weird spot at the moment. I upgarded my phone to a Lumia 900 last week and cans till return it. The thing is I really love the phone and while it stinks that I may miss out on new apps and better resolutions, I also don't want to give up my Lumia. I just don't know if I should return it and wait and see if Nokia comes out with a phone that is similar to the way the Lumia 900 looks. 

eshy says:

You should return it. the new phones will be out in the fall, it's only a few months away.
Nokia's design was a success, I'm pretty sure their WP8 will continue in that same design and this things usually get better, not worse...

Distrato says:

Yeah I probably will end up returning and using my iPhone 4 for a little while longer. This really sucks I love Windows Phone btu now I'll have to wait to use it again. 

But you already accepted the resolution 'as is' when you purchased the phone.  Why is it a concern now?

keithf1138 says:

I think it really depends on how quickly application developers move to building apps with Windows Phone 8 SDK.  From some peoples point of view that is the logical thing to due, but in reality isnt the most logical thing to do is to create Windows Phone 7.5 apps and let them run on Windows Phone 8 until thier are enough Windows Phone 8 devices in the market?

eshy says:

It depends more on the new APIs. If you want to use them, you'll create a WP8 app.
The same thing happened with android, if you don't need the newer features you better target the older platform since no one updates (with ios, almost all devices are on ios5, according to some stats released)
The best solution will be to put most of the code in a separate library that can be used by both platforms (some are already doing this for cross platform dev with MonoTouch) and just have different UI projects. 
I'm sure MS will allow devs to release different versions of the app for the different platforms.

dubbin_irie says:

There is only minor coding involved to make apps cross over??? I fail to see how apps won't be developed for both systems unless the developer is lazy in which case I don't see Microsoft allowing at least not for two years from the day 7.8 / 8 is released. Im totally shit grin happy with my titan over my old android.. Great battery life and its so much more functional. Oh and as far as iphail supporting legacy devices.. IOS 6 seems to be burning through batteries and locking up the 3gs that try to run it.... And the mango update on the focus and hd7 still are handling good from what I've read right?

Sy7ygy says:

iPhail?? You mean the OS and Phones which are spanking Microsoft to pieces are rubbish in your eyes and a failure.

You fool, another mindless drone trying to justify his purchase and be 'different'.

Go back to your hole.

vmjoaquim says:

Does that mean that with every major WP OS release, current phones are gonna get 'phased' out just like it is now?

Kadcidxa says:

even if they did do wp8 for older phones, none of it would work. at least we old phone users get something.

vmjoaquim says:

The current situation Nokia is in, I'm surprised they aren't complaining yet.

eshy says:

Well, it will be hard for them to sell the current Lumia devices now, so the stock might drop even lower and at some point, Microsoft will have to buy them (because if someone else does, it might be just for patents and the lumia line might die)

ousooner314 says:

I'm sure they're aware of what's going on. I find it hard to believe that OEMs weren't aware of this product timeline for months. I have a feeling Nokia may have some sort of strategy to handle this. We'll know for sure in the coming months.

chatscc says:

When is it expected to arrive???

henry.gray says:

I was a little dissapointed to hear this news as I have not had my HD7 for a year yet and to find out that its not getting updated to WP8, maybe if I had it since launch, I might not be so bothered. Not everyone is going to be able to upgrade to WP8 due to various reason (price being mine).
I have to say I am glad in the way that we are not being totally left out, at least we are getting something in relation to WP8, I am not too bothered about WP8 to Win8 native support apps and games for 2 reasons, I don't use my phone to play games, just the odd one thats current on WP7 and the other is I will not be upgrading to Win8 due to the fact that I am not willing to to upgrade all my hardware in my house to accomadate the touch screen etc. I also do not have the funds for a purchase a Win8 tablet.
I do agree with a previous poster, I too would also like to know what current gen users are getting in regards to features other than the start screen etc.

_Haitian says:

I'm very excited that my HTC Titan and all of the other devices didn't get left behind.

Awesome. Nokia is awesome

Blackwood504 says:

According to Paul Thurrott 7.8 will include:
"Start screen. The Windows Phone 7.8 Starts screen will be changed to look like that of Windows Phone 8. It will fill the entry screen with tiles, and not leave a strange “white space” gutter on the right side, as does Windows Phone 7.x. (This was apparently the source of some great number of user complaints, the theme being that Windows Phone doesn’t completely take advantage of its onscreen real estate. Commoners.)
Tile customization. Windows Phone 7.8 will now support three tile sizes, just like Windows Phone 8, and not two like the current version. And apps can be written to support any of the three sizes, giving the user the ability to choose between them (as is done with Windows 8’s live tiles). In addition to the current Small (square) and Large (rectangular) sizes, Windows Phone 7.8 and 8 will also support a new Smaller size, which is a fingertip-sized square that is one-fourth the size of a small Tile. Mix and match as you please.
Windows Update. Windows Phone 7.8 will be delivered directly to all Windows Phone users, bypassing the carriers. You will be able to download and install Windows Phone 7.8 over Wi-Fi, at home or wherever else, and install this update. This type of updating will be made available in Windows Phone 8, as well, as given my long, loud, and lengthy complaining about the lack of such updating in Windows Phone 7.x, you won’t be surprised, maybe, to discover that Microsoft jokingly calls this “the Paul Thurrott feature” internally."
This is very fair when you look at the fact that current phones do not have multi core processors, higher ram, higher res screens, etc.

eshy says:

Those first two are the same one - the new start screen. Thurrott always gets confused though, so not surprising...

Mr4eyes86 says:

Well this is b.s. :( My lumia 900 is an archaic pos now!!!! I could careless about NFC...I only care about not getting good games for my for my lumia 900...i'm totally pissed right now.

dameon_03 says:

i think what MS did was fair. i think it is better than being left out in the cold. i dont own a WP device yet almost pulled the trigger a couple of times but i just wanted to see what wp8 will bring. now that i have my answer i will be picking up a wp8 device when they do come out

rogeret says:

Wow.  You sound like my 12 year old.  Very grown up.  I love the logic of a person who says a 2 month old phone is archaic simply because something newer is coming in 4 or 5 months. 

dakranii says:

What the Fnck!!!  I just heard that Dodge is coming out with a new Caravan?!?!  The Caravan I'm currently driving is worthless!  The wheels are probably going to fall off!  It will cease doing everything that it's done for me up to this point!  It'll probably quit driving!  It was awesome and now this!
Thanks a lot Dodge, screw you, you just lost a loyal customer! 

Blackwood504 says:

LOL!  Right to the point!!!!

BK-one says:

that's exactly what I am hearing from the complainers.. well said...

xpxp2002 says:

They needed to pull an Apple and get AT&T to offer early upgrades for Lumia 900 and Titan II purchasers.  I think that would assauge anybody else who still feels burned by the limited scope of the 7.8 update, unless the consumer features of 7.8 include IE10 and the non-NFC parts of the Wallet Hub.

PhilR8 says:

If I could upgrade to a WP8 phone at the fully-subsidized upgrade price, then I'd be very satisfied.  Doubt it'll happen, though.  Sigh.

restlessdan says:

I'm happy with that.

Distrato says:

I'm actually really upset now. I just got my phone and now i have to go through the process of returning it and praying Nokia release a W8P that looks like the Nokia Lumia. Until then I have to use my shitty iphone. 

annaba1 says:

I guess its fair.. I just expected more exciting features... :/ Only Thing really amazing was Skype and the start screen.

Blackwood504 says:

I believe they stated that they were not going to talk about end-user features....this was more for devs than it was for the end-user.

.Emi. says:

Well this was expected... or what? people complaining expected microsoft to upgrade your phone hardware with an update? well... lol at you.
Im glad they will bring the new start screen to windows phone 7.x users,  anyway windows phone 8 sounds really good, and hopefully i can have money for it. too many good stuff announced today.

Distrato says:

I wasn't expecting my screen to suddenly display in 720P. I was expecting my Lumia 900 which I bought last week to be able to use Apps and features that would be released for the next two years until I could upgrade again. 

joecatskill says:

If you got it last week and really want WP8 you may still have time to return it... just saying...

Blackwood504 says:

So what "features" are you not going to be able to use?  You don't have a NFC chip in your phone and the screen is 720p as you noted, so what are you not going to be able to use?

AwesomeAndy says:

Current users wont be able to use any apps that target new WinRT apis or native code - which will be the majority of the new apps. Welcome to a deadend ecosystem.
I would call this worse than not getting any singular feature from wp8.

Blackwood504 says:

I get what you are saying and I understand the forward thinking but you then, are complaining about something that has not happened and may not happen.  I'm just looking at it from the other side.  Also just to point something out...not all apps on an iphone are availble to an ipad and vise versa....the same goes with android or blackberry if you want to throw that in there.

AwesomeAndy says:

I'm looking at it from this side: Microsoft had a choice here - it would have been perfectly possible to come up with a WP8 kernel for current devices. They said in the presentation it is highly scalable (to the up- and to the downside). There will likely be WP8 phones with worse specs than some of the current phones. There will likely be WP8 phones w/o NFC, on low resolution, w/o SD-card and so on.
They just chose not to do it and not to invest the ressources neccessary for this. Alienating existing high-end users, fking over Nokia's current lineup, killing the 7.x marketplace perspective, and bringing devs in an unpossible situation. Microsoft may have saved some money with this decision, but strategically it is a terrible choice in my opinion.
Personally im not that affected, i got a cheapass 710. But people who bought a $500+ WP recently? Wont probably be the most loyal of customers..

joecatskill says:

First I LOVE Windows phone 8 and some of the integration and possibilities of integration with Windows 8. Second, if you are a fan of this site most of this stuff is not a suprise. We knew dual core was coming as well as NFC and Nokia Maps integration. So, since we knew hardware was going to get faster and better, I really didn't hink we were going to get 8. Particulalely if Microsoft really  moved the software forward. 
I'm not happy that we didn't get WP8 but happy we were not forgotten. Most of all I LOVE where all this is going.

engige says:

This is fair enough with the hardware restrictions on legacy phones. I am happy :-)

buma1900 says:

everytime these kiddy discussion about legacy phones, that won't get real Phone 8 update. jus wanna ask whether SIRI is working on 3GS or 4 devices? Same issue...no discussion.

vmjoaquim says:

What if the iPhone 4 is unable to run newer games because it's written in a different code & not because of outdated hardware? Siri is just one app.

schlubadub says:

I don't understand the people whinging about buying a Lumia on a 24 month contract. We ALL knew Apollo was coming and most likely would get a crippled experience. Why lock yourself into a 24 month contract at a time when Apollo was less than 6 months away from release (now 3 months)? I do feel sorry for people new to WP who would'nt know that, but for those who upgraded you've only got yourself to blame.

My phone will be 18 months old when WP8 phones come out in 3 months. I'll either give my phone to a family member, or use it to test custom ROMs. I don't see any point in selling it... it's served me well! But then again I don't sell any devices - I still have my original C64, Amiga, Xbox, numerous PC's, and 3 mobile phones :)

mab664 says:

Uh. Does my Gen 1 focus qualify for Wp7.8? I watched the summit and they said updates supported for 18months from LAUNCH. It will be longer than that when 7.8 gets released

schlubadub says:

That's for WP8 devices... they will continue to get updates for 18 months from their launch. 7.8 is a different kettle of fish and we should all get it. It's still not clear if the carriers still have to push it out, or if this will be completely up to MS.

Blackwood504 says:

Right, and they actually said "at least" 18 months.  More than likely wp8 phones will be supported for 2 years.  I think saying "at least 18 months" is a way of them protecting themself incase they can not do so for 2 years (which is the life of a new phone).

mab664 says:

Thanks. I hope your right!

sam17ub says:

I just bought my Lumia 900 last month on a 2 year contract. I will get stuck with it with no updates for 2 years. Why couldn't they give us all the software updates? I don't need hardware specific features like NFC etc. Just give us all the updates that can run on current hardware. Also, they could've allowed the WP8 apps on current handsets. Going forward, when new WP8 will start to appear, we will be stuck with backdated apps. Is this how Microsoft treats their loyal and enthusiast early adopters? Good luck with attracting new users then. I had expected much better from them, seeing as they are underdogs in the smartphone market.

vmjoaquim says:

My sentiments exactly.

nez99 says:

Not being able to group tiles will be a deal breaker for me

olivermills6 says:

Of course it's fair. People expect Microsoft to offer the same experience on old phones as their new phones... what would be the point in that? People would just stick to their old phones. This is a good compromise - the start screen is a good (and iconic) feature of WP8 and I'll be happy with it for the first few months until I can get my hands on a new WP8 phone. Nokia or HTC, which should I go for?

Tomasz S. says:

I'd sleep better if MS confirmed that the new start screen is not the only new user feature in 7.8.
I.e. the current lack contact sharing in wp7.5 is laughable. The could at least give us the sharing menu minus the "tap" method.

Tomasz S. says:

IE10 would also be nice. With some usability improvements. IE9 is fast but that's like the only good thing about it. Doesn't even have autocomplete for forms or login.

trickym81 says:

Only the app situation upsets me.
It will suck never being able to get a new app after WP8 is released. No one will code WP7.8 apps anymore.

sam17ub says:

Yes that's my biggest worry also. No developer will do double work to release apps for WP7.8, so we'll be forever stuck with current backdated apps. Microsoft could've easily supported just the WP8 app APIs on current devices. But they couldn't care less about us. I'm sure they will regret this decision in the future. You can't anger your most loyal customers and get away with it.

keithf1138 says:

Why would developers build apps that can only run on the new platform with far fewer potential customers. Release Windows Phone 7.X apps first and move development to Windows Phone 8 SDK when the deployed device count is higher and people have retired older phones.

AwesomeAndy says:

Thats a little optimistic. I would rather think devs would stop NOW to put work into 7.x apps (except those who are sponsored by MS or Nokia), wait for WinRT and then start again. Why would they maintain what is in essence 2 separate apps (almost 2x workload) for an OS with 3 or 4 months expiry on it, no future and 2% marketshare? Seems to me that would be the dumber choice.

marek1 says:

I'm not satisfy! What about IE10, new maps etc... I hope that this new screen isn't all in WP7.8...

Coler7 says:

This was a conference for developers, to show what they will be able to do with there apps and how they will look on Wp8. We'll see more closer to consumer release

marek1 says:

That's true...I'm little bit afraid of the list of apps that was not seen (no right arrow) is still there? :-/ .....sorry english is not my mother tongue

lumianiem says:

Nokia will support us.

lex-lx says:

How come a phone launched 3 months ago like the lumia 900 is considered "limited hardware"?
Why doesn't Microsoft make the effort to put the kernel on existing devices? Windows runs on single core chips, why is NFC and multicore needed to have the WP8 kernel?

Coler7 says:

Nigga please

AwesomeAndy says:

I dont understand it either. They probably save money and ressources with this choice. Then, on the other hand, we are talking about MSFT, who bought Skype for $8.5 Billion and that other app-maker for $1 billion recently. And they dont have money for THIS? Seems so ridiculous.

marek1 says:

I think it's all about drivers (firmware) for devices and Samsung etc. don't want make an effort to develop it again for "old" devices...  I understand this for 1.gen of devices but for Lumia 800,900... it's sad..:-/ 

avg3691 says:

Any idea as to when the 7.8 update will roll out for consumers?

Coler7 says:

Wondering the same, answer our questions WPCentral!

4ty-phive says:

This update seems all well and good, but are they going to fix the WiFi issue?

abond32 says:

I like it all. Forget the old phones bring on the new ones. New everything, step up Microsoft. You can take my money. I need a surface and winPhone8.. Can't wait..

ejones_3 says:

I will take the update, simply because I didn't think WP7.x devices were going to get anything, but it sorta sucks that the phone that pretty much put WP back on the map (NL900) is getting shafted. I understand why, so I can't complain too much, but still.
NowI have to wait for some WP8 goodness for 16 more months.

BK-one says:

They should have done what iOS, does. Call it WP8 for everyone but not all features available to all models of phones.

muddtt says:

This is truth. Apple takes the better strategy on this kind of thing.

Pappa Ed says:

I bought my HTC Surround when they first came out. I will upgrade to 7.8 and since my contract us up at the end of the year, an upgrade to WP8 is a no brainer. I'm happy.

jonchai says:

Disappointed, very disappointed with Microsoft.

Coler7 says:

I'm psyched for this update, when should we expect it? And im assuming this will be in conjunction with the Refresh aka Tango update?

zigzagr says:

So reading most all the comments on here tells me that most of you don't understand that getting full WP8 still wouldn't give you any of the other capabilities that new phones will have because the phone you have now doesn't have the hardware. So it is great that they are doing what they can for existing phones. If you need the new capabilities then buy a new phone when they come out.

Auric Jarrel says:

I'm not upset at all. I bought my HTC HD7 in January of 2011 and knew not to upgrade until Windows Phone 8 came out. Now my patience will be rewarded. In the mean time I won't feel jilted by getting served up 7.8 as I know it offers the best my current phone can support.

Couldn't be happier with this news.

Dare2Blink says:

This is the best anyone could have hoped for. Seriously what did people expect? To suddenly grow a second core on the phones so that they can run more processor demanding apps? With the exceptions of a few games and apps that require native code we will still be able to do anything that a windows phone 8 will ( not count NFC but that is irrelevant to 90% of the world anyway) I'm getting my lumia 900 next week and 4 or 5 months from now I will sell it and get an ever more awesome Nokia windows 8 phone with pureview ;)

Rodney5 says:

Heys guys! I'm late to the party here. But I just read an article at wired.com that developers will be developing apps for WP-7.8 and WP-8. So it 's not AS bad is it seems. Believe me, I was pissed as well after learning that my New Lumia 900 was only going to get a new start screen! But there will be apps coming as well. 

AriesDog says:

All positives aside, this will kill sales of WinPhones until WP8 arrives.

muddtt says:

Same could be said of every phone. Galaxy S3 will kill the sales of S2, Iphone5 will kill sales of iphone 4s. Its just a part of the cylcles.

GDannyboy says:

I think it is great. I look forward to having it until I can take advantage of upgrade prices at the end of my two year contract.

mangoose says:

You cannot improve hardware via software. But does that  mean you've to make software which cannot run on previous devices? Creating drivers for new kernel is generally the hard part. But WP could have had done that quite easily since most of their smartphones have almost idential hardware, thanks to no-fragmentation:
Gen1: Qualcomm 1ghz, 512mb, 800*480
Gen2: Qualcomm 1.4ghz, 512mb, 800*480
Low-end: Qualcomm 800mhz, 256mb, 800*480
They just had to support these configurations. Now wp8 marketshare will again rise from 0. Heck, iPhone 4 runs at 800mhz (underclocked) and will be able to run iOS6. Other than true multitasking, wp8 is no way more demanding than iOS6. 
Microsoft is rather now supporting new reolutions. How significant is the difference between 768p and 720p? Rather just stay with a single aspect ratio at 15:9 (800*480 and 1280*768) and apps will continue to look good.
And the 7.8 users may not be able to install any windows8/wp8 metro apps, since the kernel is different from windows phone 7.8.

bananapeal says:

Uhm. So some of our phones are equipped with NFC ... supposedly for some future wallet service. If it's built into the device wouldn't it be nice if we were able to use it? I'd like to see wallet service as well as better skyDrive integration and a less restrictive zune.

JasonH81 says:

It's understandable because of the necessary hardware, but it does suck a lil. Time to save up.

Despite having a Titan for only a month now, I gotta say it really puts me off, but then again I could always buy a new one since mobile technology here in NZ is so late, I'm talking about a year late. So if there's a new this and that in EU or US, it'll come a year later here in NZ where it will be marketed as brand new when really its almost a legacy device. So yeah, I guess I can stick with my titan for a year more and half before buying a full pledge Apollo phone.

kikoswp7 says:

Is this update going to be on the first Gen Samsung focus as well? Im on custom flashed rom 7.10.8773.98 wonder if we first Gen wp7 users will see the update?!

anodynamic says:

Probably still plenty to come before release. Besides the start screen I'm sure there will be lots of new features in the hubs, and I'm thinking MS are trying not to tip off the competition too soon. Most of it should be hardware-independent, and will probably be in 7.8 as well.

anantou says:

It is a huge mistake by Microsoft. The right way would be to continue wp7.x as a parallel branch. They could rename it WP CE and release WP CE 8.0. The number 7.8 is very close to 8.0 and leaves little space for subsequent updates. They might release 7.9 update someday but that's it. It has upper limit and expiration date written all over it

msualum says:

It's a phone - and a good phone at that  (lumia 900).  WP7, WP8 - what the heck does it matter.  The OS works great.  The new OS (skin) will be great.  If the upgrade cycle is 2 years anyway - who cares.  Apple doesn't give all of the bells and whistles to from their new OS to the old phones - why should MS.

kallemia says:

Not fair at all. I just gave up my upgrade for a Lumia 900. It is completely unacceptable that a phone that is currently being hyped out the yinyang is going to get only a dumbed down version of the updated OS. Time to start saving pennies to go back to Apple...

Given that the hardware requirements have changed and in order to make it work smoothly this makes sense. It is a good compromise and gives current users an opportunity to take win 8 for a ride. Also early adopters are ready or will be for an upgrade by time the phones are released,  with apps from win 7.5 operating on 8 makes for an interesting transition. Can't wait for my upgrade.

muddtt says:

holy crap some of you guys are a bunch of cry babies...the Nokia 900 will be, and will continue to be a great phone for 2 years..then you can get another. If you want vanilla stick with apple. if you want to be lied to about a phone that will have huge delays in updates becuase of manufacturers and service providers get android. If your always gonna cry when something newer and greater comes out don't ever buy a phone cause something bigger is going to come out every six months.

segana says:

As a Lumia 800 owner I'm really excited for 7.8 and all the other additional updates Nokia will be bringing.

Of course I'd of loved to have Windows Phone 8 on my device, but it'd be naive of me to believe it would ever really happen.

For current gen devices to have WP8, then the OS would of had to of been seriously handicapped and I don't want to see that. I want WP8 to be as good as can be so that it can succeed in the marketplace.

I'll happily take 7.8 and then no doubt do an early upgrade to a WP8 device asap.

For those who love WP, but are complaining, think of it this way:

Handicapped WP8 = Market Fail = no more Windows Phone = go get a Droid or iPhone


henry.gray says:

Thats something that has not been addressed anywhere yet. Its getting said about the 7.8 update, coming in the coming months, aren't we supposed to get Tango first? I am sure I read somewhere on this site that some where starting to ge that update as of today?
As for apps, if you heard them talking, all apps on 7.5 will work on 8, when they did the example for the word game, they had to do a minor change. So I am sure they will still make the apps for WP7.8 if its only a small change to get it to work on 8.
Why all the complaints? rumors have been running around on this site for a while now about the chance of no upgrade to WP8 because of hardware limitations, so if you knew, why get a current gen phone now, then complain when the truth came out?
I personally am looking forward to my HD7 to get upgraded to 7.8, I just hope we get some other features that are in WP8 apart from the core things which aren't obviously compatible.
Update: Ok so just read that WP8 apps won't be backwards compatible, well I hope they make them for the WP7.8 phones first if they are easy ported to WP8

miamizues says:

I am okay with it, I knew it going in getting the lumia 900

hallam555 says:

While im due for an upgrade in the "Fall" ill be happy to pass on my 7.8 Omnia 7 to the kids to play with! Ill be upgrading to Nokia by the way, maybe the Lumia 2!!

hallam555 says:

Oh and my Xmas present off my missus will be a Surface RT.....HAPPY DAYS :)

anantou says:

It is a huge mistake by Microsoft. The right way would be to continue wp7.x as a parallel branch. They could rename it WP CE and release WP CE 8.0. The number 7.8 is very close to 8.0 and leaves little space for subsequent updates. They might release 7.9 update someday but that's it. It has upper limit and expiration date written all over it

psychotron says:

So my loyalty gets me a tweaked UI, hm? I think we're done here.

sna499 says:

Windows is making a fool of its users. They could have easily done a strip down port (removing the extra features which will not work like NFC, Dual Core etc) of the WP 8 to old WP 7.5 mobiles (man these devices have every minimal requirement Processor, RAM, Graphics accelerator). They won't do, cause new features are not that cool which may insist old users to buy new WP. I don't know how good is Microsoft's marketing strategy, when it is competing with Android, iOS, and nevertheless new Blackberry 10 OS. I don't see a single chance for Microsoft nor nokia. Alas! I wasted money on buying Lumia 800. However I can atleast play with my old Galaxy S II, and thanks to the opensource  android project, I can install any version of android on my device even if the phone manufactirer decided to stop providing. :)

MadSci2 says:

Its not like anyone will scroll this far down but you can color me disappointed (it closely resembles cyan, hint hint). The hardware limitations are obviously not anything they can change, but it is possible to write a new Win 8 Kernel for recent devices, they have simply chosen not to. With device integration being so key to the future of WinPhone and Win 8, dead-ending the current crop of phones is u wise and disappointing. Think of how this contrasts with Nokia's actions to address the initial problems with the L900? In less than 2 years MSoft will have deadended my brand new and expensive HTC HD2, HD7, and L900. That's a very poor way to treat the few Customers you have.
If WP7.8 devices will have App integration with the Surface RT and Win8 PCs than this is less of an issue, but as they were silent on this it seems unlikely. If I were MSoft, I would take a leaf from Nokia's playbook and give a voucher to everyone who bought a WinPhone in the 12 months before WP8 is released. That would by them Brand Loyalty others would envy.

muddtt says:

i scrolled here.

shawshank87 says:

This is so true. I've been touting my phone since I got it and have been such a loyal fan, but this move is horrid.  I feel betrayed and ripped off that a premier piece of hardware is launched this close to a new OS upgrade and won't be able to update.  I can't tell if it's laziness, terrible market strategy, piss poor PR, or all of the above.
Oh well, learned my lesson.