Nokia Lumias
221

Looking at Nokia’s carrier exclusives differently and what is Verizon’s Lumia 822?

With yesterday’s announcement of the Nokia Lumia 820 and 920 coming to AT&T, the word that caught our eye and yours was “exclusive”. Even Rogers is now in on the "exclusive" action. The term was applied to both Lumia devices, although as pointed out in our forums, the 820’s exclusiveness to AT&T was dropped from Nokia’s site later in the day. 

The tech’o’sphere has responded quite negatively to the news if only because the Lumia 920 has built up such demand that many people are cheering for its success. That success though depends on how many people can actually buy it, which in turn translates into carrier availability. If the Lumia 920 is only available on 1 of 4 major US carriers, well that’s certainly less people than had it been on two or three carriers. A pretty obvious impact.

The notion that the masses will drop their contracts with an existing provider and run to AT&T (or Rogers) for the 920 is misguided. The 920’s hype is just not there yet and with “family plans” growing in popularity, switching is just not as feasible as it used to be. Sure, some will switch but churn for specific devices (as opposed to being fed up with service) is just not that high anymore.

ATT specter

 

Why exclusive?

The first area we want to tackle is how this situation even arises. Lots of folks are blaming Nokia for the decision but the fact of the matter is we don’t know the details. Here are some scenarios though that come into play:

  • AT&T could have refused to carry the Lumia 920 unless they had it locked in
  • Non-AT&T carriers and Nokia might not have reached an amicable deal, with either side potentially turning down the other
  • “Exclusives” could be timed. AT&T may have it all to themselves but only for a short period
  • AT&T/Rogers may have an exclusive but only on that model number
  • Exclusive deals often pay more to the OEM upfront
  • Carrier deals often involve more than just the phone e.g. support and advertising

Chew on those reasons for a bit as they all get mixed into the bag. Sure, Nokia needs to put this phone on as many carriers as they can—they know that—but they do have to play ball with the carriers and at least here in the US, those guys play for keeps.

AT&T and Nokia have a fairly strong relationship. The carrier embraced the Lumia 900 in the past with only a mediocre response (the 900 was hardly the run away success people were hoping for, though it did greatly raise awareness). It makes sense that the carrier would, in essence, demand Nokia give them—and only them—the Lumia 920.

That’s not good for consumers but those who live in the US should know by now that the mobile phone business in the US is hardly buyer-friendly. (Anyone else notice all the carriers have rolled back the 30-day no-risk trial back to 14 days?). In essence, Nokia is trapped by the very system it needs to participate in—just like you and I.

Nokia Lumias

 

What does exclusive mean?

Here’s where we head into some speculation territory but there is some evidence here to support the ideas being put forth. To put it bluntly, AT&T (and Rogers) may have an exclusive on the Lumia 920 specifically but is that tied to the phone or the model number?

Verizon is expected to get the Lumia 820 or rather the Lumia 822--that much is known and that model number change should tell you something about what is going on here.

Verizon 822

Verizon's upcoming-phone database

Nokia in the past have said they will work with carriers to have specialized, unique devices. Another company actually knows this system very well: RIM. If you ever found it difficult to keep up with all the BlackBerry 9xxx model numbers, you’re not alone. While that system is confusing to the consumer, to the carriers it means they have something special to cling to for advertising.

We think Nokia is taking the same tactic here and while the tech press is getting itself all wrapped up in the AT&T announcement, they’re forgetting that T-Mobile and Verizon have yet to announce anything yet for Windows Phone and Nokia.

We’re not quite prepared to say that there is a Nokia Lumia 922 for Verizon—frankly we have seen no evidence that it exists, but we do know that there is an 822 and Nokia to us appeared confident that this AT&T-exclusive controversy will blow over.

 

Lumia 822 Arrow

Anyone remember me?

 

So what is the Lumia 822?

Anyone remember this image, thought to be the Arrow? Notice we have yet to actually see that phone announced? It’s not the Lumia 920 (too rounded) and it’s not the Lumia 820.

People who are familiar with Verizon know they don’t like to be “just another carrier”. They too, like AT&T, want to offer something unique and we think the 822 is just that—a mix device between the 820 and 920. Could it be a 4.3” more rounded phone with the same PureView camera technology? It could very well be though details are non-existent at this time.

Through the grapevine we’ve heard that a certain US carrier may an announcement as early as Monday. We’re thinking T-Mobile at this point and it will be real interesting to see what they get, though we’re leaning on just the “820” model for them. So far T-Mo aims for “middle of the road” as opposed to “high end” for their customers.

Morpheus

 

And the take away is...

In conclusion, this whole exclusive mess may be much about nothing. Nokia’s Chris Weber said as much back in January and reiterated in June—they’re seeking to offer carriers “unique propositions” to help them bite at the Nokia line. From Bloomberg in June:

“The key to getting more Lumia phones into consumers’ hands is giving each carrier a “unique proposition,” so they can show how the devices stand out from the iPhone or Android models, Weber said.”

The fact of the matter is while consumers want the Lumia 920 on every carrier the carriers do not, so Nokia will have to offer each something “unique”. Nokia discussed this as recently as July with the Financial Times.

How that translates to getting consumers what they want remains to be seen. Whether carriers get a modified Lumia 920 or something else will be crucial—after all, it’s about the PureView camera and other 920 specialties that people really want.

For now though we would rather wait for Verizon, T-Mobile and other carriers to show their cards before lighting our torches and grabbing our pitchforks. Hopefully some of the evidence we’ve shown here will make you do the same.

Additional photo credit: Anka Galuza

2
loading...
3
loading...
42
loading...
0
loading...

Reader comments

Looking at Nokia’s carrier exclusives differently and what is Verizon’s Lumia 822?

221 Comments
Sort by Rating

I'm going to wait and see where this goes before rushing to conclusions. Wait to see what Verizon puts out.

Wait!?  Daniel, you're counselling patience?  We're not supposed to run of the side of a cliff in our rush to judgement based upon limited information?
THAT'S JUST CRAZY TALK AND WON'T BE TOLERATED!

First, this article could have been written when the Lumia 900 was announced as an exclusive, and we saw how that turned out for Verizon users.   (Someone even spotted an elusive 910 that some thought was going to Verizon.) 
 
People will react based on past experience, and that has taught everyone that only AT&T gets flagship Nokia phones, and that is why everyone is reacting so negatively.  It's (in the article) speculation versus the reality of past experience. 
 
Second, my personal interest in WP8 phones goes in this order; Nokia 920, HTC WP 8X, Samsung Ativ S, then the Nokia 820.   So to me, if Verizon offers the HTC WP 8X and Samsung Ativ S,  then it doesn't matter if the Nokia 820 is there or not.  Fortunately, I use AT&T but that isn't the point.
 
Phones, more than any other device, are sold in the wild when people compare phones at work or out.  For Windows Phone to be successful, I believe when someone pulls out their new iPhone or Android phone, you need someone to pull out the very best Windows Phone made.  I believe that's the Lumia 920.   I believe that phone will shut everyone up and make undecideds consider a Windows Phone.   I'm not convinced that happens if someone pulls out an 820 (or 822) to compare against the iPhone 5 or Samsung Galaxy S III.
 

Do you mean in the back near the supply closet because it's not an iPhone or Android device???

It is really hard not to jump to conclusions when past experience has plainly shown that if you don't jump to AT&T you don't get anything close to a hero-level phone. IOW, we all expect to get screwed, because of the near monopolistic exclusivity deals with AT&T.

NEW POLL-
Let's see how many American/Canadian consumers are willing to switch carriers to get the 920 vs how many will end up getting the 8X and what color.

I'm in the minority, switching carriers to AT&T for the Lumia 920. I'm tired of Sprint's slow and unreliable service in my area, not to mention their complete lack of support for the Windows Phone platform.

I would have considered switching to Rogers but I just found out that they are only carrying the black so I won't be switching for that. As it is, there are not any carriers in Canada intending to carry the 920 in colour which is rather pathetic. I thought for sure that it would be the L920 or nothing for me but the 8x has to be considered now.

Its not really that big of an issue for me because after the 8X was announced that's pretty much been the phone I've been set on getting,,,but I am interested in the percentage of how many people are willing to switch after reading the news that the 920 "MAY" be exclusive ATT and Rogers in Canada.
The last few polls that almost 90% of the people that voted were for the 920 I want to how much that's changed,,,,if any.

I personally think the 8X looks the best but I would rather have the 920.  The 16GB on the 8X is too small.  I currently have the HTC trophy, which is an awesome phone, but I always have this thing full.
Even though I want the 920 and voted for it there is no way I will switch to AT&T.  I have unlimited data on Verizon and plan on keeping it.

That's why I think we need a NEW poll,so people can RE-vote for the phone their actually more likely to get since since the 8X will be on 3 major carriers in the US and the 920 as far as we know so far will only be on ATT.

If you want color, put a cover on it. Too many people are making too much of a big deal over color. It would be like turning down a Ferrari 599 and getting a Porsche 911 because it only came in black, even though you love the Ferrari. The L920 is a quality phone, and I'm getting one regardless of color.

Currently trying to switch away from ATT to Verizon.  I was hoping to do it with the 920, but dosn't look like that's going to work out.
 
A great phone with crap service is, well, still pretty crappy.  

Daniel, the torches are out and they are even getting the kerosene. Nokia needs to fix this stuff up quick or the flames might engulf the whole Lumia WP8 launch all together.

But Nokia are not responsible for carrier announcements.

Who's more to blame here: Nokia or the impatient tech geeks who cling to breaking phone news and can't wait for the big picture?

Patience is a virtue that is lost in modern day teachings and the fast speeds of the internet. I am patient and this issue isn't even my concern as I live outside of the US. But CNet, Gizmodo and PocketNow aren't and are officially pronouncing it DBA (Dead Before Arrival).
One just feels that Nokia needs a better media department. The OIS scandal and all the secrecy on price (even though I feel that Nokia's waiting for the GNote II pricing before they commit) aren't helping Nokia's cause one bit.
 

You're right patience is a virtue. And the hyperactive society we have been diving head first into over the past few decades is simply horrible.

"OIS scandal"

I for one disagree that it's a scandal. The "scandal" is only being perpetuated by the douches over at The Verge, and anyone who wants to latch on to that. Hell, people are going out in droves to by the iPhone5, yet no one is screaming for the demise of Apple, or calling them liars (which they should.)

Not true... I've had several iPhone users mention the OIS fakes to me after I mentioned the Lumia. All are non-geeks and never read The Verge. Like it or not, it was mentioned in numerous sites where iPhone 5 & Lumia were compared - with the OIS issue haunting it like a ghost. I've seen a few articles casting Nokia in a very negative light, basically saying they rushed the new Lumias, in a panic to beat the iPhone5 announcement, and the OIS was faked out of desperation. Hopefully the actual release will shut everyone up about that... Or get them talking over how great it is

We got the point. But seriously, I how could any talk of exclusivity not cause people to dig out torches and pitchforks, especially when HTC managed deals with three of the big four? No matter what the real reasons for the deals, after Nokia's announcement a heck of a lot of us feel like we've been taken for a ride again.

While I like the 8 series HTC has put out, I prefer the L900. Since I found out MS is making their own phone, I'm going to attempt to wait to see it. Besides, I'm on a contract, and the longer I stay on it, the lower the early termination fee will be

WMPoweruser is reporting that MS is working with Huawei on the new MS phone and that it is going to be a midrange device.
Not the best source but atleast its something other than Nokia news.

Hi Daniel, while I normally agree with you, I don't here. Tech geeks don't have well compensated PR departments, nor do tech geeks have to focus on delivering customer service. I am inclined to think/agree that some of the criticism directed at Nokia over this issue is overheated - but that is what happens in the world of delivering products to a retail market. Companies that handle it well anticipate problems and are prepared to deal with them in advance. Right now, Nokia is doing nothing to respond to the understandable frustration of potential future customers. Sure, Nokia can't announce what carriers are going to do, but they can speak directly directly to their fans - tech geeks. Important customers at that, as it is those tech geeks who drive what Malcolm Gladwell described as a "Tipping Point" for both products and companies. Something is obviously wrong if yesterdays announcement caused it to be a better day for HTC than for Nokia. Also, as a side note, I think that people consistently pointing out that the 820 or variations of it not being exclusive only makes people more irritated over this. No one who had their heart set on a 920 is going to have that wound salved by availability of the 820, not even a souped-up version of it. They would more likely buy a top of the line product from either HTC or Samsung than a second tier phone from Nokia, a phone that no matter how good it is would still irritate them as being a lesser phone than the Lumia 920. Irritation, frustration, disappointment and venting are understandable, and maybe even warranted right now given yesterdays announcement - at least in my opinion.

Imo people are so over dramatic about this. Granted this site is mostly by American's so i guess it makes sense, but still. 
We are talkking about North America here. Nokia getting Lumia 920 and Lumia 820 available for China Mobile is 10 times more important than Nokia not having their phone via Verizon. Rest of the world does not know exclusives and are not locked to carrier tyranny. 
 
HTC did not get any of it's WP's to China Mobile with 650 million subs. 
China is Nokia's largest market and by far world largest Windows Phone market. Also world largest smartphone market. 

I dont understand why some people are trying to underestimate the significance of Verizon wireless in promoting the Lumia brand and Wp platform by citing the availability of the Lumia line in China mobile. It is true that China Mobile is the largest carrier in terms of number but Vodafone is the biggest in terms of coverage and revenue. Let's not forget that it was the aggressive marketing of Verizon wireless that push android to become a global force. I have traveled to China on a couple of times and the truth is not many people in China would dish out $ 500-800 to purchase a Smartphone( no disrespect to my Chinese friends) so it would be a bit difficult for China Mobile to push the Lumia 920 in drones as some people expecting. I never liked CDMA Technology and Im not a fan of Verizon Wireless but you got to respect them for the marketing prowess

"Nokia getting Lumia 920 and Lumia 820 available for China Mobile is 10 times more important than Nokia not having their phone via Verizon..."
 
Well, it's 10 times more important for Nokia to be available for China Mobile.  But as I do not live in China and I'm restricted to Verizon due to business, it's 10 times more important to me that they be on Verizon.
 
Obviously, Nokia needs to make enough to survive and China Mobile helps that but the concern being raised here isn't about Nokia's survival but about access to the 920 for individuals who aren't and don't want to be on AT&T.

@Heron...Your post was the most 'drama queen' post I've read today.
 
Or perhaps you're being facetious?
 

Silly human, Nokia doesn't care about protesters. They care about the media who can make or break them but not the tech geek population. Their main concern is turning future isheeps into lumia-sheeps and that has nothing to do with us tech geeks, hopefully.
The fact of the matter is that they need to get what they can now whether it is a truck of money and free marketing and brand awareness from At&T and Rogers.
 
Getting smoked in sales by the iphone 5 and the GS3 on multiple carriers is technically worse than getting smoked by them on one carrier. It's just less messy. You take your AT&T money and free brand awareness and let them clean up the damage from the war.
 
Apple waited for 3 years and Samsung whored out the GS1 and GS2 as exclusives until the time was right to strike. Nokia should do the same when they amass more power. Hopefully, the 940 is the right time with the iphone 5s sucking even more and the people using Android get overwhelmed by the constant customizing and rather be spoon fed.

I like being spoon fed. That's why I switched :D +1 but I disagree about Nokia waiting to release on multiple carriers. Who's stopping Nokia from making an unlocked device compatible with TMobile? If they are so confident in their product, they should release a non carrier branded phone compatible with all of the GSM frequencies. No need to get in bed with TMobile. Verizon might be a different ass hole altogether since they're CDMA but there are work around for TMOBILE. The marketing would have been done by word of mouth. No fucking way the camera isn't going to turn heads when you post your pics on farcebook. Excuse my language. Nokia fucked up with 900 and I suspect it will be the same with 920. Im on TMobile but im going to get the att 920 and pray that it works well with straight talk or some other prepaid carrier.

And I disagree because they're not going to reap the benefits of the windows 8 launch. People will opt for HTC when they learn about win8, rt, etc

I'm sorry I was pulling for Nokia bought the stock, bought the L710 on T-MO frankly I'm sick of the "exclusive" thing. I know T-MO will not get a high end WP8 though some would say the 8x is high end I don't at 16gb. BUT. at this point if Nokia puts the L820 on T-MO I'll buy the 8x just to say sorry I don't want the weeded down device. I'll vote with my wallet.

Yeah I'm with T-Mobile too and I'm really perplexed by the possibility of the same thing happening like it did with the Lumia 900. You have a phone that is the clear "I gotta have it" phone for customers and cripple your sales by only offering it on one carrier? NOTHING can justify the idea of selling your greatest achievement on ATT as opposed to ATT, T-Mobile, and Verizon. With that being said, the HTC 8X is a wonderful phone in its own right but hopefully Samsung can come in and save the day being the only high-end phone with expandable memory. Those are high end power houses in their own right and I believe T-Mobile will get both of them.

Well if Verizon gets a variant of the Lumia 920 it better be sooner than later. A 30 day exclusive with AT&T would be great. Anything longer and the hype wears off

Whatever it is, if it doesn't have a camera >= 920camera I'm not buying a Windows Phone.  I'll stick it out with my Trophy until something with that good a camera comes out.  There's no point in getting less, when that's what I wanted from the 920.  Some people want the sound - great, go for the 8x.  Some want screen size - great - go for the Ativ.  I want the camera.

@hopmedic...I would just like to say, that I enjoyed ready your very reasonable post.   It's been a challenge lately to read such, with all of the dramatic and over emotional responses various sites have been flooded with these past few days.

Well, I have to admit that if you'd read my tweets from yesterday (since deleted) calling for Elop's resignation (yes, I'm a stockholder), you wouldn't have told me that.  But I've calmed down, and yes, I'll agree with you.  Lots of emotion.  But that's what happens when they show us something that we really want, and then they tell us that we can't have it.  This is the problem with the anti-consumer attitudes that our US carriers feel that they have to have.  Ridiculous.  Just tell us what you're going to offer so that we have the right expectations from the start, and life would be a lot better.

I did put up a survey, though, to show Verizon and Nokia what we want.  And while the phone call I received today was in reply to a different email I'd sent the other day, I got a voice mail response to an email I'd sent to one of the Verizon execs through their website.  I'll call back on my way home, and I'll tell her about the survey.  So far, over 360 responses, 96% want the Lumia 920.
http://bit.ly/VZW920Svy
If you're a Verizon customer let them know which phone you want.

Kudos!
 
You did a good thing - contacting the carrier to express interest in a specific device and/or OS. 
 
Many were upset when Verizon wasn't a launch partner back in 2010 when WP hit the market.  Many took the time to contact Verizon to express interest.  Did it have an instantaneous effect?  No.  But eventually, Verizon released the Trophy, albeit 6 to 7 months later.  No WP devices since then, but it looks as though more are on the way, and hopefully Nokia devices soon.
 
Hope you get good news, and please, share :)

Update on my poll and Verizon's response. I had contacted Verizon execs through their website last year prior to Trophy's release, and spoke with one of the assistants in the Alpharetta, GA office (45 min from me) on the WP subject at length, several times.

Last month after the 920 announcement, I reached out again, and spoke with the same woman, and she remembered me. Last week, when WPC ran the story of the rumored upcoming ATT reveal of the 920, I sent another message through email showing them the link to the article, and telling them that ATT was once again going to beat them through the gate, and that they were going to miss the boat. Thursday after hearing of the exclusivity, I was quite angry, and after settling down, I put up a poll on a site that I'd originally set up but never followed up on back when I was going to create a poll because I wanted to show VZW that people wanted WP because they didn't pick up any of the original Lumia devices. That poll is at www.verizonwp7.com (because I bought the domain name in January). Go take the three question poll, please. So far there have been more than 550 responses, and at this point, 96% want the Lumia 920 on Verizon.

This morning, that same person from the Verizon Southeast Region Exec offices called me, said she'd just received my message (that I sent last week - who knows how many people it goes through), and wondered if ATT has released the phone. I told her that they announced Friday that it was going to be released on November 4. It was GREAT to be able to finally give them some solid information and not just rumor for a change.

I also told her about my web page, and that there were only about 500 responses (this was before I looked at it this morning and realized there were over 550), and told her that I realize that's not a lot, but I'm a nobody with no name recognition, and no way to get it out there other than twitter, but at this point 96%-97% want that phone. She said, "No, 500 voices is a lot of voices, and I appreciate that, and I'll take a look. I told her that there is a button at the bottom of the page that you can click to see the results without taking the poll. She said thanks, and she'll take a look, have a great day, and all that.

Maybe we're making progress. Who knows?

Good question, but I don't think it will matter to those declaring their disappointment in Nokia with their new found love in the HTC 8x.

@elcaporegresa....I didn't say anything was wrong with it; however, I do find aspects of it childish, dramatic, and immature.

At the very least, can we get to the bottom of this? Is it true on the exclusivity? And if so, WHO is responsible?

I'm going to upgrade on my timeline. If Nokia wants my business, they can have a Lumia 92x device on Verizon. Otherwise, hello HTC 8X. It's really that simple.

Agreed. I don't know who's "fault" it is.. Or even if there's anything to be all that concerned about. But I do know.. I won't switch my carrier simply for a phone. And I HOPE these companies realize that there are a lot of people like this.

I used to feel this way until my carrier decided to hate WP (Sprint).  So I jumped ship to AT&T and have enjoyed the best phone selection ever.  I do pay a bit more monthly but it isn't substantial and I do have better and much faster coverage in my area. I use on average 1GB of data per month so the limits AT&T imposes do not impact me. Looking at ANdroid, WP, and the iPhone, AT&T has the largest most diverse selection of all carriers and this is more important to me than saving a few dollars per month.

Oh don't get me wrong..  If I was on Sprint I'd do the same!  Lol.  Sprint has never been a dominate force in the wireless world in my opinion.  But I'm on Verizon.  Absolutely superior when it comes to coverage.  I could have switched to AT&T or TMobile, paid less, and had a HUGE selection of windows phones.  Instead I stayed with the better carrier, wiling to pay more, and I have an HTC Trophy.  Frankly, ANY wp8 will be an upgrade, and I'll gladly take the 8x.  I just can't see switching to a different carrier with not so great coverage for a phone.

It'll be a non-issue only to those who live where the network has been refarmed. I expect the process to take well over a year, if not two.

Daniel, youre so smucking fart. I remember all of this. Funny how we have short term memory.. This is all true. I even remember that leaked photo

Well I hope Verizon gets the 920 I am tired of my iPhone and want something different. Other than that if Verizon does not get the 920, I am upgrading to the new iPhone, I been eligible for an upgrade since July and have no desire to waste it on an iPhone, but I will (Hear me Nokia - Microsoft).

Why don't you get the the 8x. That is a great phone as well running on WP8. If your not happy with current iPhone getting the same phone won't make you any happier. 8x is great phone with great features. Much better than new iPhone in my opinion.

"I am tired of my iPhone and want something different...if Verizon does not get the 920, I am upgrading to the new iPhone, I been eligible for an upgrade since July and have no desire to waste it on an iPhone, but I will"
 
Let me see if I get this straight: You are tired of the iPhone, but you're willing to get the iPhone 5 simply because you want to use your upgrade, but only on a Verizon 920 that probably will never happen? Do you think the iPhone 5 will make you LESS tired of the iPhone? You wouldn't consider the 822 or the 8X?

Why don't you just jump ship? Go to AT&T? Since you're eligible for an upgrade, that means your contract is up... or almost up? But if you are grandfather, why not go for the HTC 8X?

I see you're mad, but still. We still have no idea if its exclusive or not. However, even if it is, I still wouldn't get the iPhone 5. I would probably get HTC 8X.

Lumia 822 = Verizon Raped version of L820
e.g. HTC OneX onverizon = Droid Incredible 4G LTE
p.s. screw you carriers i'm not on your nerwork because I like your awful branded phones i'm here because the service is good in my area

Hope this quiets the storm on the people crying foul on Nokia. They are still a business and have to play by business rules and standards.

I have 4 lines with an iPhone 5 ab iPhone 4s a galaxy II skyrocket and my l 900 I have unltd data and the others 3gb w taxes and family text is 233

Yesterday when Daniel said "more on that tomorrow", I thought he was hinting that Verizon would make some sort of an announcement today. I was wrong. Lol

Sounds like Att neutered Elop in the U.S. I hope Samsung has the balls to follow the Galaxy pattern and gets the ATIV on all carriers. I also understand now why Microsoft is making their phone now.

If the 920 is exclusive I'll just buy the 8x which is too bad. I wanted the 900 but got the 710 because I wanted to wait for 8 to get a high end phone. Nokia has the best product but why care if I can't have access to it. Really takes the excitement out of my year plus wait for a high-end WP since my first WP the arrive.

All of this makes me want a Surface phone.  I'm frankly sick of always waiting for SOMETHING on the Windows Phone side of the fence.  Give me a phone sold at the Microsoft store, and I can do what I want with it.

@1jax not sure what u smoking. Att uses windows computers. Microsoft does what it wants. Att is a peewee compared to Microsoft.

What does the OS on their computers have to do with the phones that they carry?
 
Sure, MS can do what they want, but if they want AT&T to carry their phones they're going to have to play by their rules.

There are three weeks until Windows Phone 8 is officially released, and apparently a month until phones are released. There is still a lot of time available for more information to be released. VZW may announce their WP lineup, and we may see this mystery Nokia phone yet.

Sadly this will probably be the solitary, unheard voice of sanity amongst all the hate and anguish being spewed by tech sites and users alike. Personally I hope it pans out as described, not for the sake of the raging loonies wishing death and destruction on Nokia because they may not get their chosen PHONE, but for Nokia's continued recovery and the growth of Windows Phone.

Agree.  The drama surrounding the Lumia 920 by those not on ATT, or unwilling to switch carriers or at least wait for details from their current carrier, has been astounding. 
 
The outrage almost rivals the Nokia announcement to discountinue Symbian! 

Seriously. I was rather surprised that TechCrunch, CNET and Gizmodo joined in the FUD wagon. Actually, come to think of it, I shouldn't have been surprised.

It's all click bait. They figured out a long time ago that talking smack about windows phone will attract all of the Apple/Android fans who want to see it fail and all of the windows phone fans who want to defend our OS of choice. Gotta' get that money honey.

It has been pretty amazing. I haven't seen so much interest in a phone in a very long time. It seems like people are kinda pulling for it. Anytime there is an article on a website about Nokia or the 920, there seems to be over a thousand comments.

Who's fault is that may I ask? att&t Nokia or tech websites like this that talk about Nokia and the 920 How many things have been posted about the 8x? or the ATIV? 99-2

It's not just the tech sites. It's the consumers reading those tech sites as well. It's funny how these bloggers form opinions for their readers. Our society is turning into a drone-like culture. Just follow the queen bees!

So, last week I went to my local VZ store and straight out asked the sales guy if he had any idea if/when they would be carrying the L920. He went to his computer and snooped around and said that all he could tell me is that there was a Nokia phone listed, but he couldn't tell me the model number. So, this only adds to this developing story that we really don't know what model VZ is getting, but it tells me that it "appears" they will be getting something. 
Honestly, I would be happy with an 822 varient of the 820, if they can include the Pureview camera from the 920, but in a more 820 style case (allowing removable storage and wireless charging). Maybe this would differentiate it from the 920 since it wouldn't have the larger, super sensitive screen technology- which I'm sure drives the cost up for the 920. 
At the end of the day, I would be fine with even a mid-range Lumia on VZ. I would use the Nokia exclusive apps all the time!  

Could I hope and say that maybe Verizon will offer an "exclusive" Nokia Lumia 92x in RED only???   grrr... wishful thinking :-(

Here's a great solution... When your contract is up...MOVE TO ATT we all know they always get it FIRST!!! I knew this will happen that's why I ditched tmo when att came out... The only people complaining about this are the people who doesn't run NOKIA..
PLEASE SMH!!!!!

A. At&t is inferior coverage wise in my area.

B. At&t is 120 for 3gb data, my Verizon is 70 for unlimited.

C. Don't need another reason.

Rumor has it, next time you upgrade your phone, you are losing unlimited data.  No more grandfathering from VZW.  Even moreso than that, you will be pushed to their new shared plans, which I think are more expensive than the old plans....all told.

I'm talking about buying full price, not subsidized. I'm aware that if you upgrade your pushed into share plans. Even at full price I'm saving a ton of money in the long run. I use 7+ GB a month.

Just curious how much do you pay at ATT. I have 5 lines with Tmo. Unlimited talk and text 2GB of 4G for each line. With taxes I pay a shade under $220. What would ATT charge for that? I tried a note a couple months back and it was like $80 for 1 line. Also where I live the data was faster on my HD7 than the note.

The problem with your suggestion is that ATT's service isn't amazing everywhere.  There are locations where ATT sucks. I'm on ATT and have no problems with it, but I can't recomend it to my Father-in-law because the service at his house is spotty.
I find it ironic that the people who have complained over the years how "ATT is so overpriced, they suck...blah blah blah" and then they express such indignation when those higher rates make the exclusivity deals like this possible.
edit: btw, i posted this before the page refreshed and the two posts above me provided examples

Bottom line is exclusive phones give the carrier a reason to give a fuck and promote the phone on some of their dime and not leave everything to the OEM ( happend with the ATT Lumias more than any other WP handset in the US).
 
In an ideal world, Verizon would get its own "exclusive" WP handsets and then maybe they would put a fraction of their promotional energy into it. Just think about how hard Verizon pushed their "DRIOD" line of Android phones. It wasn't even really a push for Android but more of a "We know you can't get iPhone on Verizon yet but here is a Verizon branded smartphone thats ALMOST as good" type of campaign.

I kind of think that Apple/AT&T created or helped create the Android juggernaut by going exclusive on AT&T for so long.  The other carriers needed something competitive and the Android phones all got as good or better than the iPhones.

Well said, and while I am not indignant towards Nokia for the situation I am feeling incredibly jaded toward my provider for the lack of apparent support.  Currently I'm with Bell, a move I had to make due in part to better coverage and speeds but also because they were the only provider to offer the HD7 when my last contract came up.  It may still be rumour at this time as to how many WP8 they will be offering come launch, they have not offered any WP7.x devices for the better part of this year.  In fact a quick glance at what is currently available by one of the largest providers in Canada shows 2 BlackBerry, 3 iPhone, and a whopping 16 devices available for Android's OS.
I also understand that the number of devices for Android far outweighs that of the upcoming WP8, but if the rumours hold true then Bell will only see 2 WP8 devices at launch.  It's been said before and I'll say it again, OEMs and Microsoft cannot rest on their laurels with this OS.  There is a need for a major marketing push, not just the tech news push.  Fans can only publicize their love of the OS so far, but if these devices miss the advertising mark then people wont know to ask for them.  If they are unable to find them in store, as you mentioned, there is little chance they will look elsewhere.
It's a brutal cycle North American providers have managed to put into place that somehow truly only benefits a select few and until other letters in the alphabet can garner the same clout a "i" has it doesn't seem likely to change any time soon.  As soon as the Lumia 920 hits the markets I will be scouring the web to see if it will play nice with the Bell network.

Luckily AT&T is holding 2 days of WP8 training for their employees. To me that shows a huge commitment from AT&T to push WP8 into the public hands.

For a moment I thought you were being sarcastic but then I remember a post where someone talked about the 2 training days: An official training day and a make-up day. It's not 2 days' worth of training, right?

Carriers have training courses for nearly every new high end device that launches.  People that talk up training as a huge commitment have never worked inside the telecom industry.

The only high end smartphone Tmobile gets is the Galaxy line but shows Windows Phone midrange love. My Radar is tard slow in processing applications and I can't even unlock my Lumia 900. I hope the 8x and the Ativ S fill in the void.

So it does appear that carriers are most at fault here. I dont understand the silence though. My God, you know people are waiting for news on this, why say nothing?  Especially since ATT announced exclusive 920, why risk losing customers by saying nothing?  Unless you really have nothing planned that will measure up to the 920......
Im holding out hope for Verizon, but I will not wait forever. If I have to, ill leave. Im going to lose my grandfathered Unlimited plan one way or anohter anyways, eventually. They already have things in place to deal with that. So, they better announce something soon. Or Ill take advantage of going to ATT, and getting subsidized cost of a 920.
 

As Nokia may VERY well want to release on multiple channels...
But it might not be to far to suggest that an Apple channel manager might say "if you decide to sell the Nokia line, we will greatly reduce the number of iPhone 5s for your network"...
And that carrier manager is forced to weigh in on... a sure sales item (iPhone5) versus a truly innovative product that would bring excitment to their network.
 
 

Don't be silly. Apple doesn't have that kind of control anymore. They're not #1 in marketshare. Plus, greatly reducing the number of iPhone 5s on a carrier hurts Apple more than the carrier. The carrier will just sell more Androids or WPs.
 

Great article Daniel, I know everyone gets pissed about the "exclusive" label but it's nothing new I for one am leaving Tmo 3 months early for the 920 on att, hopefully Tmo finds it in their heart to waive my breakage fee or at least lower it.

Uh in 3 months you should be able to use any att phone on tmo. Tmo's re farmed network goes live 2013. You can have your 920 on tmo with LTE at a fraction of the price. If a 900 is something to go by you should be able to pick a 920 like new off Craigslist for $100 to 200 bucks.

This is why Microsoft NEEDS to release their own Surface Phone, which will be carrier-less exclusive.  This will help the WP8 grow in masses.....

You know that pple are not buying these because these are windows phone from Microsoft..:).. pple done like MS and grow in masses?.. come one man give me a break..
Nokia hoped that they can pull windows phonee but the baggage is too much i beleive.. let us see what happens in windows phone 8..
 
But yes, it will grow in masses if it is unlocked for 100 dollars.. I would buy it.

You can't blame this on AT&T or Rogers.  It is Steve Elop who made that decision.  I heard that he said in a interview specifically that he would do exclusive deals for L920.  He thinks that is a better way to market premium phones.  This is the second major mistake he made in the process of killing Nokia.  The first one is that he openly announced the death of Symbian while introduced the new Windows phones.  Nokia shares thus dropped from$20+ to $2.  Nokia doesn't have to be Windows exclusive.  You provide choices and let market decide like what Samsung and HTC are doing.  Now he is making his second mistake by choosing to sell L920 through exclusive deals only while Nokia is dying to expand its carriers to maximize the phone availability to all potention buyers.  Nokia only has a small window of opportunity to pull herself out of the financial mess.  It looks like that Steve Elop will blow it again. 

Elop said that because truth be told, the AT&T/900 deal worked out better for them than the Europe/Lumia 800 method. The latter was the spray and pray approach--put the Lumia 800 everywhere on as many carriers as possible.

It didn't work out because the carriers didn't promote a phone that everyone else has. They had no real incentive to push it.

I take it you are referring to the Galaxy series, and you might have a point. Still, that would be the exception and not the rule. It's probably something Samsung can do, but Nokia is not in such a comfortable position financially as Samsung.

Samsung doesn't push Windows Phone. I've been to a few tech events lately with Samsung, no ATIV S to show off. And not a single carrier has announced they're carrying it.

Exactly. Just notice how Microsoft has started pushing Surface... but Samsung isn't pushing their ATIV tablets.
They are pushing their crap Galaxy Tab with Android and S-Pen.

That's true I even tweeted them asking the same ? and they were like can't say right now so as to not give misleading info.

With only 600,000 of the 900 sold that exclusive deal didn't work in the U.S.
3.6 to 4% market share stinks. Would you send your troops out to war with only 1 in 4 with a gun? Or 1 with a machine gun and the other 3 cap guns. Nokia needs to make sure everyone who wants one can get one on their carrier. That strategy worked for the #1 cellphone maker.

We will soon find out which method will work better for push WP8 premium phones.  HTC chooses the spray and pray approach for 8x while Nokia insists on the AT&T exclusivity for L920.  The WPCentral poll gives L920 82% while 8x gets 12.7% for user preference.  We will see whether the sales figure would reflect that percentage ratio.  I think 8x sales figure would get much higher percentage than 12.7%.  Nokia will have nobody to blame but themselves.

Everyone is mad about the AT&T thing but does anyone know anything about an international unbranded version?
My local carrier just brought the 900 ... like a month or month and a half ago (a bit dishonest I think) so I do not have any hope of seeing the 920 soon. My only way to get one would be an international version.
 
Any ideas, tips, gossip, whatever?

Who cares about the 820/822? Why would anyone choose that over the 8x? People want the 920. I'm on Rogers and I don't want another black phone. If Nokia was smarter, they would make it on every color EXCEPT black. Anyone with a colored phone will standout and be a practically walking advertisement for you. Instead, you choose to sell only black in Canada.

No, a lot of people don't want the 920 not because it's too good but because it's too big. There's a lot to be said for a 4.3" device or something smaller.

Take an 820-size device and put in some 920 magic and that's an impressive offering. 

Ohhh, you make a good point. Nice little loophole. Same things on the inside, just with a smaller screen. Or maybe they will go with the interchangeable back plates instead of the solid frame. Who knows, if they are making it unique to Verizon, maybe they will add sd memory and swappable batteries. I'm really starting to see the benefit of offering a unique experience to each carrier. Verizon "should" know what its customers want and expect from them in the devices they offer, so maybe they have worked out something special we don't know anything about. Maybe a variant 922 will come around December/January after the 822.

If they make another model, they will be watering down their advertising, spreading it too thin between multiple models. Compare to Samsung who advertises the GS3, not GS3a,b&c. Also, January will miss out on Black Friday and Xmas.

I agree. Many people would like a smaller 920 (not me, though). However, that's not what the 820 is about. There are definite hardware tradeoffs beside the size difference.

Well I am one person here who will buy 820 over 8X. come on, it is more than just colors and looking good on day one.. any way enjoy your 8 X.

Really, Tofu?
 
I would choose the 820 over the 8x, or any HTC!  And for those who need additional storage, at least the 820 has expandable storage, unlike the 8x.
 
 

Well, the 8x has better camera and screen than the 820. I'm thinking for those whose carrier doesn't have the 920, the 820 is a tough sell vs the 8x, provided prices are similar.

elcaporegresa...I don't care about anything that the 8X has to offer.  I'm purchasing a Nokia Lumia 920.  But if there were no Lumia 920, and I absolutely needed to get a new device, it would be the Lumia 820.  HTC will never see more than zero cents of my money.
 
Your thirst seems to be sufficiently quenched with the HTC kool aid, though :)

I'll will not likely change carriers should because of a phone. If Verizon only offers a 2nd tier Nokia phone I will not buy it to make a point. I'll get the 8X instead

Well enjoy your HTC experience.. once their Andriod stuff becomes hot, the will not even know you. and wonder you will now have a colored phone which you hate for 2 more years.

Dude, why you trying to talk the man out of getting the HTC phone? If you're a fan of WP, you should be supportive of trying to grow the ecosystem. HTC 8x is a very capable phone. It has great hardware, but more importantly, it's running WP8 and that's the thing we're trying to help grow isn't it?

Make a point to who, Verizon?  By still giving them money with the purchase of a 8x and a 2yr contract?  Some point :)
 
Verizon chooses which devices to carry, no oem can dictate or strong arm a carrier to carry a device. 

China Mobile will carry the Lumia 920; so, with its 667 million customers it quite defines how well the 920 will succeed. Other large operators with hundreds of millions of cutomers will carry it as well. Thus the small US-based operators like Verizon appear quite irrelevant.

I agree with you home boy...china is the most important thing right now..then you have India,south Africa's,Europe Scandinavia...dudes I feel bad for you if ur with vzw,or the others...nokia needs to be strong where it was before and that's the most important thing right now..

I'm thinking a poll for north america,would you buy out your current contract and pay ATT for 920 for 2yrs OR just buy outright? Guess we'll have to wait until pricing but as of now id lean towards the latter.

I figure such a high number of WP fans just bought put and switched for the 900 when the perception was it would be available for upgrade to 8 originally with the first wave of sales.

The number of WP fans left to do so can't be that high,add in regular people having new note and ios choices at the same time,all of this cuts real hard into nokias chance of success with a carrier exclusive.

I think these exclusives are great news.. .for HTC! The 8x will be available everywhere....and its a unique enough device that im sure many will feel satisfied with if a carrier change is the only way to grab a 920.

Wow. Nokia just jumped off a cliff in Canada. Rogers does not even have coverage in most of western Canada. They will lose a business client if this is not resolved soon.

It's not the end of the world .. There's still second gen WP8 .. Chill. And we still have no news to whether or not, Lumia 920 is exclusive.

"there's still second generation wp8....chill"

yeah because after no-do there's mango and if you're lucky and your carrier cares you get tango before Apollo. If that doesn't get released in an area where the exclusive carrier gets good service,wait until the next generation AGAIN. sorry guy but miss me with the BS.

If this is MS business model prepare to say hello to palm and Symbian,what a joke to even mention chill and wait longer to people that have been chilling since WinMo 6.5

I really enjoy the OS but if MS can't get all flagships on at least 2 of majors this OS is DEAD in North America soon. #fact

Well.... I guess it may be the HTC 8X for me since I'm on T-mobile. I would love to have the Nokia 920, but  there is no way I would go to AT&T. To me, AT&T & Verizon = Being Shafted. Sorry....
Just the thought of paying more for less (based on my needs as a local user) to companies with a history of screwing their customers -- No thank you
HTC 8X, you better be good enough, or I'll just stick to my boring old Galaxy S 2.

I find it hard to believe that Nokia couldn't work some kind of deal with Verizon and T Mobile to bring the 920 in. Like I said yesterday, the 920 will not be a major seller on At&t alone. Sucks!!!!

As I point out, if AT&T demanded that only they get the 920, that doesn't leave much room for Nokia to give to other US carriers, does it?

I'm not sure TMo could afford a Nokia high-end phone (or just may not want it) and Verizon, well, I think their 822 is something different.

If Verizon's 822 has OIS, it'll be a solid choice. But as someone said previously, anything we get will be an improvement over the very capable HTC Trophy.

I'm personally not interested in the 822 or the 8X....so Verizon I guess your not getting me to sign a contract with any of the models you get unless you get a 920/922 or a higher end model from HTC (Zenith ?). The 8X is a mid-line model and I will not accept anything less than I high end phone this time around....
 
A new model with only 16gb and no expandablity is NOT a high end in my eyes...Dont care how much you sugar coat it...
 
Come on Verizon, Your move...
 
Edit: it does make me wonder... If AT&T is claiming exclusive with the 820, why is the 822 listed ? Is that image a fake ? That is about the only hope I have of Verizon getting a 920/922 model, yep, at&t has the 920 but, Verizon has the 922....Hmmmm
 
Maybe the 922 will skip the SIM slot and put in a MicroSDXC slot (support up to 128gb)and in that case, it would be epic and AT&T users might swich over to get it...
 
That WOULD be the perfect phone right now...

Well you'd still need the sim slot since LTE uses it.  Plus it isn't as simple as just swapping out one slot for another.

I won't be moving to ATT. I would move to Verizon. It will behoove Nokia to offer something with pureview to that carrier. That is what I want in a phone. An 822 with preview would warrant a switch. I just hope I get the chance to give Nokia my money.

Finally, the voice of reason!! I've been waiting for Dan to put out an article like this. It should be linked on every tech websites to get people to calm the eff down!!! Btw, in a lot of forums I've been reading how people now don't want to get a WP8 cause it's not offered on their carrier. I find it interesting in that people seem like they were more willing to "tolerate" Windows Phone OS as opposed to just wanting it for the phone alone. I can't think of the last time people wanted the phone more than the OS. That's a testament to Nokia and hopefully they can get this phone into as many hands as possible. I think anyone that's on ATT and into WP8, should buy the 920 like crazy so that the other carriers take notice and if they aren't already, work with Nokia to bring out the 920 or something just as capable as soon as possible. I just think it's too bad that people aren't willing to try WP8 on other devices like the HTC 8X or the Samsung Ativ. Both nice devices and deserve a chance to help the ecosystem grow.

Yeah I thought the same thing. People are willing to go with iPhone or android if they can't get L920. I switched from iPhone to WP7.5 for the OS not the phone. The 8x and Ativ have nice features and most importantly run WP8. If the L920 wasn't on AT&T then I would gladly get the 8x because the OS is better than what Apple or Android offer.

Exactly! It wasn't the end of the world when I couldn't get a 900, I just knew when my contract was up I would be able to get the next Nokia and so could anyone else if they decided to go with an HTC or Samsung this time around.

I think a lot depends on how long the exclusivity clause runs for AT&T and Rogers. If it's only 30 days then thàt wouldn't be too bad. As long as Nokia can open up multi-carrier availability for their new Lumias in time for the Holiday shopping season.Otherwise HTC stands to be the big winner since their 8X is a nice phone.Maybe not up to 920 standards but better than the 820.

30 days is acceptable (as long as Verizon claims they will get it) but, if it's 6 months or more, it's old news. There will be rumor of 8.5 devices by then and this whole process of preying Verizon will get will start all over....
 
I'm starting to really hate Verizon....

I am disappointed but we also don't have the full story. We'll find out all the details closer to launch.

Agree I'm also waiting to see what Verizon & tmobile have but as much as I want the 920 I don't see it on tmobile since they rather get the affordable versions like the 720 & Verizon might make a mixture of the 920 with that said it would not be a 920. But for no I'll wait patiently.

All I want is the Lumia 820 on T-Mobile... I hope Daniel's comment about an announcement made by them on Monday pans out. I recently got two texts from T-Mo telling me I'm eligible for an upgrade, although my current two-year contract isn't up until mid-January. Really excited over the prospect of snagging me an 820!
Good read, by the way. :)

I'm on Sprint now (HTC Arrive) but when my contract expires I'm committed to going to T-Mobile. Having a Windows Phone option of any kind is the main reason. Price and, most importantly, unlimited data are the deciding factors of where I'm going next.

Well you very likely could have the choice of the ATIV S, 8X, and 820 on T-Mobile so that's at least 3 good options you wouldn't have had if you stuck with Sprint.

Well I'll buy NL920 AT&T version full price and uses it with Solavei which uses T-Mobile Spectrum so I can use it with 1900mhz hspa+ speeds here in Las Vegas for just $49.00mo and f*** AT&T haha (mean laugh)

Until the day that Nokia announces a Verizon flagship phone they are screwing up very badly in the US. They are falling very short of their goal of providing a unique phone for all major carriers in the US. So far only AT&T has ever received a unique phone from Nokia and an 820 announcement for TMO next week does nothing to change that.  

When HTC came out with the 8X, everyone said they were getting it, instead of the 920. Now that they know that MAYBE the 920 will be exclusive to AT&T, they're mad? What ?

I wait and wait and im only met with more disappointment. I've been patient since the first generation of windows phone came out. I'll wait some more but I doubt the Lumia 920 will even come 1 foot away from At&t.

With what we actually KNOW as of right now for sure, I still have to place the blame squarely at the feet of Nokia and Verizon.  There is a lot of speculation in this article (a lot that has merit, to be honest), but only the parties involved know the truth.
 
So, Daniel, what IS the 822 based on what you know?  Are you not in a position to say or are you just not willing to go on record with what you've heard?  You seemed to be overly coy about it in this article ...

Its def not nokias fault, they want the phone on as many carriers as possible, I know that here in Australia both Optus and Vodafone refused to take the 920 despite Nokia offering it to them, hence Telstra not getting the "exclusive" tag attached.

As long as the 822 adds either the Pureview camera or HD display of the Lumia 920 then I think it is a sufficient upgrade over the regular 820 to make it an extremely high end phone exclusive for Verizon. Because the 820 is so versatile Verizon has the power to decide how much memory the phone comes with and whether the wireless charging back is included for free or not. Aside from the camera and the display the Lumia 820 internal specs are identical to the Lumia 920. So if Verizon gets to improve either of those aspects of the phone with the 822 it makes a big difference in the perception of that device and how much value you can claim the device has out of the box.

If you add an HD display to the 820 it goes from mid-range to high-end in my opinion.

The thing that keeps coming to mind for me on the exclusivity is that it's always a possibility that Verizon simply didn't want the Lumia 920.  In fact, while Nokia and HTC are both Windows partners that doesn't mean they aren't competing with each other.  I could imagine a deal where HTC offered to sell their WP8 series to Verizon for less so that the Verizon subsidy to get the phone to that magic $200 price point would be much less - in exchange for not carrying the Lumia 920.  The situation right now even fits with that - the only confirmed "hero" WP8 phone on Verizon is the Windows Phone 8x.
 
And on the topic of carriers and exclusives...the more I think about it the more I think that might be why MS is making the Surface phone.  Whether or not it's a contender with the Lumia 920, WP8x, and Ativ S it would certainly be a great option for anyone on Sprint.

Pages